LivePhish boards and (generic city) jams

[Alumni]

Anyone know how much revenue the band is getting from the sale of recordings on LP?

It just seems funny that the band (1) is always careful to minimmize royalties, and (2) very rarely makes the mistake of "finishing" jammed cover songs. Gorge R&R is the only example that immediately comes to mind.

With all the talk about Trey's chops, or confidence, and everything else, is it possible that those boards are taking an option off the table? When Trey hits a wall, it would be the easiest thing in the world to return to the main song theme to buy a little bit of time . . . but that just doesn't happen. Instead, they end up slamming into another song or dissolving into ambient wankery.

Granted, this doesn't explain when that happens to a Tweezer or Sand . . . maybe there's nothing to it.

[mattstick]

there's nothing to it.

[Alumni]

Yeah -- I guess it's a bad sign when you start having 2nd and 3rd thought before you even get to the [submit] button.  :-D

I tried to give you an excuse, Trey. I tried.  :|

[pcr3]

if it makes you feel better, i briefly wondered the same thing a few times over the last few shows, especially last night during the "Mansfield Jam".

[Gumbo72203]

I'm not sure what you're trying to get at, Alumni.


From my understanding of it, once the jam leaves anything that could be reasonably considered a jam on XXXX's chord progression, they cut it to another track, because that increases the # of tracks overall, decreases the length of the cover track, and lowers its ratio. 


Like, if you have to pay royalties on the song vs. its context, while not vastly significant, changing a songs ratio from 1/22 to 1/23 does end up making a difference in the end, money-wise.



Or, it could possibly have something to do with copyright infringment: They are trying to sell something of theirs (Venue/City jam) under someone else's name (the original song). 




But this has been going on for a long time....  with the Tinley Park Jam from 8/13/93, Darien Jams 1-3 from 9/14/00...  and those were released well before the Livephish.com site was up and downloading every show. 

[Alumni]

The speculation was that the need to cut to another track (and not go back) might be influencing the way the band plays.

A LP CD released in 2001 doesn't influence how something was played in 1993. But now that LP is a daily part of the band's operations -- does that have an influence? That was the original speculation.

[mattstick]

It's not like Trey sits there and tracks out these shows right after the encore.

Things that Phish do impact livephish.com, not the other way around.

[Alumni]

Agreed. And if 3.0 were a complete moneygrub, then they wouldn't be playing covers at all. It just doesn't hold water.

[Gumbo72203]

If 3.0 were a moneygrub, they would open the archives and let fans order any show they wanted.  Then, once someone requests it, it can be put up for mass sale.  That way, they don't have to go about mastering and remixing every single show, just the ones that people initially want to buy.




Which I guess is every show...

[kellerb]

Don't all profits from livephish.com go to the mockingbird foundation as of a few years ago?

Anyway, there is no chance that "Oh, we need to leave this cover unfinished to alter the livephish.com royalty-percentage" is actually a thought that occurs onstage or before.

If those royalties mattered that much, they would just not offer the covers for sale/DL.

Does the royalty-percentage-what-have-you factor into the "cuyahoga jam" track splitting?  I see no other reason to do the track-splitting like they do.

[Alumni]

Don't all profits from livephish.com go to the mockingbird foundation as of a few years ago?

Do they? There's a good chance I wasn't paying attention back when that announcement was made. I assumed it was just part of their business model.

[whyweigh5.0]

I believe it's still a portion of the profits to Mockingbird

[rowjimmy]

I believe it's still a portion of the profits to Mockingbird

This is correct.

[mattstick]

Don't all profits from livephish.com go to the mockingbird foundation as of a few years ago?

Anyway, there is no chance that "Oh, we need to leave this cover unfinished to alter the livephish.com royalty-percentage" is actually a thought that occurs onstage or before.

This is true.

If those royalties mattered that much, they would just not offer the covers for sale/DL.

They still make money, they just have to pay some of it back to the songwritiers.

Does the royalty-percentage-what-have-you factor into the "cuyahoga jam" track splitting?  I see no other reason to do the track-splitting like they do.

We went over this in another thread, the length of the cover is inconsequential to the royalty rate. 

However, "Cuyahoga Jam" becomes another song for Phish to use any way they choose.  If they wanted to use it as the background loop on a DVD menu, they no longer have to pay the original songwriters, etc.

[kellerb]

Don't all profits from livephish.com go to the mockingbird foundation as of a few years ago?

Anyway, there is no chance that "Oh, we need to leave this cover unfinished to alter the livephish.com royalty-percentage" is actually a thought that occurs onstage or before.

This is true.

If those royalties mattered that much, they would just not offer the covers for sale/DL.

They still make money, they just have to pay some of it back to the songwritiers.

Does the royalty-percentage-what-have-you factor into the "cuyahoga jam" track splitting?  I see no other reason to do the track-splitting like they do.

We went over this in another thread, the length of the cover is inconsequential to the royalty rate. 

However, "Cuyahoga Jam" becomes another song for Phish to use any way they choose.  If they wanted to use it as the background loop on a DVD menu, they no longer have to pay the original songwriters, etc.

Those explanations are just crazy.  Now I agree with Alumni's theory of them specifically planning it out.    :-P