Pre Hiatus VS Post Hiatus Phish

[xanadux3]

most realize theres a big difference between pre hiatus and post hiatus phish. I feel that before hiatus most jams were always leading to a peak, always building building building until they explode with an awesome peak. Post hiatus jams seem to peak but not really build like they did before hiatus, they would just have bursts of intensity out of nowhere. It seemed like post hiatus jams were like books with seperate chapters and each chapter was a different sort of jam while prehiatus every jam kept the same theme going (obviously there are exceptions roses are free 4-3-98). What do you guys think the major differneces are between pre and post hiatus, or do you even hear a differnce at all?

[fauxpaxfauxreal]

Biting my tongue.

:-D :-o

[August]

Biting my tongue.

:-D :-o

[cactusfan]

Biting my tongue.

:-D :-o

what faux and august are perhaps trying to say, xanadux, is that for one thing, yes, there is quite a difference between pre- and post-hiatus phish, and yes, everyone here has noticed it.

secondly, that the descriptions you offer of pre-hiatus jams versus post-hiatus jams are, shall we say, lacking in nuance.

and thirdly, that for anyone here to truly delve into the nuances of the jam styles of pre-hiatus-- which mind you constitutes what to many ears here would be a notably different style every year of phish's existence, if not multiple evolving styles within any given year-- versus those of post-hiatus would be to write an incredibly long and complex post.

in fact, i would go further to say that in some small ways, virtually every topic on this board goes in part to making those very distinctions.

hence-- and again this is just a sunday night theory after a glass of whiskey or three-- hence the number of people who've read this post and the few who've responded.

it's just too much work for a sunday night.

i will now return to my bananas!   :banana:        :banana:          :banana:

[jedifunk]

yes, but thanks for asking!

[Marmar]

Not touching this one with a 10foot pole.....

[sophist]

i only need a five foot pole  :evil:


& what cactusfan said 



maybe this equation will help  :wink:

:banana: ->  ->  -> Ted Kennedy

[ucusty]

there is no legit comparison

[Itsnotanexperience]

I've said it at least 50 times before on this board and will say it again - there are PLENTY of examples (which I'm not even gonig to waste time listing b/c this subject is OLD) of brilliant, Phishy, jams, PH, that can easily hold their own w/ several, pre-hiatus, jams............'nuff said.

The primary issue after hiatus was consistency, period.

peace

[jedifunk]

i think your missing the point of this discussion itsnot... (or lack of discussion)...

no one is disputing that there were great jams PH, that can certainly hold there own vs. prehiatus...

easy back, have a cup of coffee and a donut and chill

[Marmar]

I will make this comparison:

Pre: The jams were about how fast and tightly the band could turn a corner at any given moment in time.....and at times bending space-time ........

Post: The jams were centered on a groove, and little devience from that groove was tolerated.....the "boat" lost its ability to turn on a knife-edge, and space-time warped the band.......

[mattstick]

I very much enjoyed the maturity and confidence Phish played with post-hiatus.

Now I realize I'm different from most people when I say this, but here's why I enjoy it more than most people.

With The Grateful Dead and Phish each year/tour/show was building on top of the next.  Listening to Phish from when I started in 94 was a journey through their sound, it kept changing, not always for better, but always changing.

The evolution is what's so fascinating to me.

With The Grateful Dead, I've heard probably hundreds of shows from the 70s and I love them all, but now I feel like I've heard that part of their evolution, so my focus is on 79-95 now, when I put on a show, it's usually from that era.  Most of the time I cringe during those flat 80s sets, but it's still the Good Ole' Grateful Dead, and when I put it in the context of growth and development, it's MORE historically interesting to me than a random mind-bender from the 60s or 70s.

With Phish, the idea is pretty similar, up until 2000 I would've told you that my favorite year of Phish was the current one.  Now though, '96 is my very favorite because it reflects an interesting turning point in the bands sound.  It's not as slick as '97 or as monstrous as '95 but I like it because it's a unique turning point for them.

Similarly with post-hiatus Phish, I really feel like there is a maturity in the way that the band jammed - they didn't have to crank out the sonic dissonance like they did in '95, or try trippy effects like 99 and 2000.  The songs they wrote that did jam really blossomed into fascinating soundscapes (Miami 7 Below anyone?).  So in that spirit, because the past is in the past and I've pretty much heard it all, and the most present Phish is 2003/2004, that's probably what I listen to the most.  It could have something to do with all the great SBDs, but I have a feeling it's more in my approach/attitude towards the constant state of flux which Phish played music in.

For me it's not a matter of pre-hiatus rocks, or post-hiatus sucks; all Phish is unique enough to warrant a listen, and once I've heard a lot of the older shows I "bank" it, and usually won't listen again for a long long time.  With the post-hiatus stuff I come back to it more, and it's nearer to my heart because of the good times I had on tour at the end (36 post-hiatus shows).

Sorry to ramble - I've tried to explain these philosophies to some friends, and I really only have 1 buddy who "gets it" with me, so I don't really expect any of you to!

[Marmar]

Well said.....

The inverse is the way I feel about it......the older shows bring back all the great tour memories, and good times......etc.....

[jedifunk]

see, that plays a HUGE part of the time periods we prefer... matt did a lot of PH tour, so he has a rooted interest in that period... marmar is ole skool, and that matches up with his listening...  i myself, toured extensively from 1997-2000 and thats why i usually end up coming back to that era... thats where i can make an absolute connection.'

and thats not to say that i cant/dont listen to other periods (see the last show thread for evidence) or that matt or marmar dont/cant either, but its where are memories and hearts live....

that in and of itself plays as big a role as anything else, IMO.

[mattstick]

For the sake of clarity I saw twice as many shows pre-hiatus as I did post-hiatus.

It was'nt until post-hiatus that I realized a lot of the charm of Phish tour was the people you were with - also, when I was a college student and went on tour I was barely getting by, selling beers/waters/sodas on the lot to pay for gas money and camping every where we went.  When Phish came back I was staying in nice hotels, spending days by the hotel pool before going to the show and not spending much time at all on the lots - I have amazing memories of chilling in the venue for 2 hours before the show (after waiting in poster lines) and just RELAXING and enjoying myself, not getting stressed.  That made post-hiatus Phish much more chill for me.