week4paug.net

On Stage: Music and Sharing Forums => General Topic Discussion => The Ophishial Week4paug.net Show Club => Topic started by: August on May 29, 2006, 12:14:57 AM

Title: R1/W03: 07-10-1997 Espace Julien, Marseille, France
Post by: August on May 29, 2006, 12:14:57 AM
here is my pick and let me say that it is nothing like the last two.
this show starts off super solid and turns disgusting (in a good way) from the bathtub gin on.
this show was the last two set show off the summer euro tour in another tiny venue.
this is a must have show for me and hopefully it will be one of yours as well!
enjoy!

here are the compressed sets...
set one

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=E2A210C85B6CFAFC

set two

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=D6125D6C38FB6BDA

and the torrent on etree

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=25169

i am on this, so dont worry about being stranded.
also, i joined all the "sick funk jams" on the compressed files.
thats kind of annoying.

a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 12:17:59 AM
What happened to picking a show that would have me and Jedifunk coming to blows?
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on May 29, 2006, 12:18:25 AM
Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 12:17:59 AM
What happened to picking a show that would have me and Jedifunk coming to blows?

this is it.
a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 12:27:07 AM
Quote from: august on May 29, 2006, 12:18:25 AM
Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 12:17:59 AM
What happened to picking a show that would have me and Jedifunk coming to blows?

this is it.
a

He's not going to like this show?
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on May 29, 2006, 12:29:45 AM
i am not sure.
maybe you guys will agree and that will just fuck everything up.
a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jedifunk on May 29, 2006, 12:32:10 AM
:-D
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 12:36:17 AM
MUHAHAHAHA.  MY REVENGE ON AUGUST IS ALMOST COMPLETE!   :samurai:  (AUG IS THE ONE BEING SLICED OPEN BY MINE AND JEDI'S AGREEMENT).
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jedifunk on May 29, 2006, 02:15:46 PM
ok well here goes...

1st set... well, 1st off this isnt my favorite kind of funk, a little too slow & bluesy for my tastes (but i still love it!)... as far as improve goes, this set has IT!  the "f" jams were everywhere...

starts standard with dog stole, limb, ginseng... the the Gin opens up to interpretation, going very far away from gin, and funking it up, and then coming back!

llama->funk... more of the same slow deep, stinky funk...
funk->lizards jam... interesting morph, very smooth, and i dig, even if lizards aint my fav song.

2nd set... not nearly as good as the 1st set, but just as much fun!

2001 was super deep, and just the right time length... enough time to get the funk in and get out!

magilla>yamar->jam>ghost>to the river... i enjoyed the jam out of yamar.  nice & loose, and they were obviously having a great time! the ghost->river however, IMO, was fairly lacking.  i didnt find this ghost nearly as engaging as most 1997 ghosts, and the river jam wasnt much more than a jam with lyrics over the top...  which is fine.

funky bitch is very tight and a great fun way to finish up the show...


conclusion?  well, IMO, not the best example of the euro 97... but a great show nontheless... i prefer the more exploratory shows of amsterdam...

highlights?  Bathtub Gin is sick... the funk is deep, and page is in full effect with all his toys.

i'd give it a B+/A-...
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: VA $l!m on May 29, 2006, 03:01:27 PM
this is the 1st week i'm on the bandwagon...
partially b/c i already have this show in my collection= i'm lazy. :-D

just finished up the llama funk...... i'll comment when i finish the whole show-- thanks for the pick!
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on May 29, 2006, 03:58:09 PM
Quote from: VA slim on May 29, 2006, 03:01:27 PM
this is the 1st week i'm on the bandwagon...
partially b/c i already have this show in my collection= i'm lazy. :-D

just finished up the llama funk...... i'll comment when i finish the whole show-- thanks for the pick!

nice to have you,slim!
there are always the mp3's for each show if you dont have the discs.
unless you are too lazy to click on those!  :wink:
sometimes it takes almost 3 minutes to get it!
a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jedifunk on May 29, 2006, 04:26:22 PM
:-o   three minutes!  sounds like you need to get "high speed" interweb!
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on May 29, 2006, 04:36:45 PM
i get my mp3's by horseback.



nneeeeiiiiighhhhh.
a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jedifunk on May 29, 2006, 04:42:35 PM
pony express?  yeah i heard fedex is looking at a hostile takeover...
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 29, 2006, 07:45:12 PM


Here we go...I'm in the midst of the first set...and I figured I'd give my thoughts on the show.  Like so many summer 97 shows, it opens with a medley of new tunes (2 of them). 

First up is Dog Stole Things- you can tell they're in a small club.  It has that intimate sound.  I like this song a lot, and was sad when it dissapeared forever in 98.  I always loved how fish would drop the Dogs Stole Things beat, and everyone would exclaim "yesssss mound!"  and then you would hear the collective groan when the guitar line came in.  Loose, club version of a tune I like.

Limb by Limb follows it up.  Trey tries really hard on his singing at the beginning.  He is soooo soulful!  And it's immediately obvious when Fish comes in for his harmony that Fish had had extensive vocal lessons/rehearsals.  Compare this to the Fog that Surrounds that we heard last week...and there is an incredible differance.  You can't even tell that Fish had at one point been a horrible singer, he actually hits the right notes and is in the right key.  Limb always sounds too much like Taste to me, but this jam section is incredible.  I know some of you are huge Limb fans...but I don't like many versions, and I like this version.  "Trampled by lambs and pecked by the dove".  Indeed.

Ginseng Sullivan is up next, and this is my favorite Phish doing bluegrass song. (And Two Dollar Bill And Uncle Penn).   :banana: :banana: :banana: My muddy water mississippi delta home!  Such a great tune.  Not the greatest version....but it works.

And then comes the Bathtub Gin..first true old school phish song of the night.  The opening is great and not tooooo heavy like some later versions (I think page went too far after a while and became too aggressive and oppressive during the beginning...)  but this one is light and fun. Trey jumps in too soon on a lyric line and page quickly pushes him back down, I would have loved to see that.  The opening doesn't sound like Trey is listening to page very well at all.  The faucet lick comes and you can tell that this Gin is going to be slow and drippy...a little tooooo slow (imo) (but then again my favorite Gin is probably The Real Gin and that is a FAST gin.)  I love the vocal lines-->the jam opening.  This is a great gin going into the Gin.  It plods along like only a Gin can.  Trey breaks out the leslie like he was prone to do summer 97.  And Fish is going great guns.  Trey fires off a rock star lick as Fish RAT-A-TAT-TATS on the drums.  And then Trey winds down into a trippy dissolution of the rock star style.  And he sustains the low notes to signify the jam is in full effect....RAT-A-TAT-TAT!  Great interplay!  Boom...boom....booom.  START ROCK STAR....dissolving down down down rat-a-tat-tat!  Going again!  The jam starts off sooooo smoking!  Page hammering away in the background!  And then...it gets spacy....Page on the moog.  Trey still wailing!  Trey playing rhythm.  Fish pounding out the beat.  Mike looming in the shadows.  Yes, Trey lets go with a sweet ass blues lick!  Trey is playing some dirty ass rhythm and blues.  Then Mike takes over.  Trey is playing what sounds like "The-Bathtub-Gin" in a deep bass sound.  The jam quiets down, like the jam is prone to do and you can tell the band will either explode with a theme or dissolve into bathtub gin.  Fish is keeping the beat going...so thats a good thing...it's an 11 minute gin already.  And then out comes the delay loop.  The Moog is on.  Mike is letting some notes fly.  Then out flies the wah.  Trey is on the wah.  What will come next?  Will a nasty theme develop?  Mike is accenting perfectly...what's coming next?  Delay still flying in the background.  And you can tell it's going to be a dance party.  A soft silent and quiet dance party is emerging.  Fish has to be fighting hard not to pound it out.  Great Trey-Page interplay.  Page is on the Clav now.  His clav lines running counter to Trey's guitar lines.  And Trey hollers something out unintelligibly.  Trey goes back to rhythm wah...signifying a start-stop and starts yelling "woah" on the downbeat.  Start-Stop in full effect.  It's at this point that I start to get bored with the funk.  It's fun to dance to but not too engaging...this is full on Ghost like mode.  Fun to dance to.  But, I much preferred the hard engaging style of the beginning of the Ghost.  This is fun, but not too meaty...a Bathtub Gin lick brings the crowd to its feet....but they don't up the intensity too much...this is still light.  I do like the jam a lot more with the Bathtub Gin licks coming out.  All in all a fun Gin.  This is the summer 97 style in a nutshell.  Trey on wah.  Page on Clav.  The mad magician Mike on deep bass.  And our own Character Zero slappin the skins.

LLama is up next, and this one is extended further too.  I like the dark edge this gets.  More clav/moog from Page.  More wah guitar from trey!  There's a section where the song sounds like its crying sadly and passionately and I like that part.  And then some weird keyboard fart noises.  Which are cool.  This would have been a fun LLama to see live.  This is deep space llama for only the first set.  I like it...but it isn't profound.  Page is making a lot of lazerbeam sounds which I think worked a lot better during the 6/25/97 McGrupp (which is a much better show btw, in case you all were wondering :samurai:).  And then the jam spaces out....

Into Velvet Sea.  This is great placement for the tune.  They placed the tune VERY WELL summer 97.  It works very well after dark and psychedelic jams.  After the 30 minutes of Gin/Llama this is a good place for it.  Sounds great.  Good tune.  I dig it...everyone else will give it a  :banana: probably....but I like it.

What starts up next is very odd.  It sounds like it's a new song with a reggaeish beat...AGAIN TREY ON WAH.  Why didn't anyone note that summer how much Wah trey was using.  Summer 97 Trey used his wah and page used his clav more than they EVER HAD BEFORE.  And I don't remember reading that they used those two things so much before going on summer 97 tour...and THAT IS LIKE THE TRADEMARK of that summer.  This starting jam sounds like the type of funk employed during the INCREDIBLE segue from DWD-->Mike's from 7/22/97...and I like this kind of funk a lot.  Really this sounds like it would fit right at home in a DWD or a Tweezer from summer 97.  Trey teases a tune at 3:55-4:05 does anyone know what he's playing?  It sounds like the return in Dogs Stole Things but differant....it's definitely a tease of some type.  Then at 5:03 he lets off an almost tease from The Saints Go Marching In.  And then at 5:33 he unleashes the Lizards.  And it's apparant from the second he launches in that it's the Lizards.  A great tease...ending to this jam.   I like the Lizards ending a lot so this is a cool coda to launch into.  And then Olivia's Pool to close...which is a fun song. 

All and all that was a fun ass first set.  How someone can love this show so much, and not love the Lille, France show is beyond me, since they are so obviously similar (except that the Lille, France show is more "cohesive" and flows better imo).  Same vibe, same sound, everything about them is similar.

A great show, I think the jams ran on a little too long in the funk vein....but a great first set nonetheless.  And the first 5-7 minutes of the Gin jam and the Lizards jam are AMAZING.  Great stuff.  I'll post later about the second set.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: susep on May 29, 2006, 10:13:10 PM
Gin>subtle loop w/ Trey heavy on the wha, Page playing along nicely>tempo increases slightly, band opening up a bit while staying tight into vocal jam alternate funk series.  Page exclaiming "yeah"!  Saints tease(the jam out of Cities>Saints from 1July is great Summer '97)>Gin theme jammed, Page responding>continues...

Llama>faster tempo funk(better then Gin right off imo), Page Jerry Harrison descending keys>deflating sound while the funk bed underneath rises>Trey multi-chording w/ Boomerang, more techno Page.  Jam evolves nicely before a dissident Trey tries several times to return>jam fades in an active pulse>N02esque>

Sea>interestingly Trey's loop remains quietly active.

OP>nice way to end the set, Trey playing some compassionate leads>
"get some air" or puff a few?

2001>set opener somewhat rare in the funk era, the air helped>tight funk>subtle horn sounds/effect by Page.  Audience estatic>Trey chording very hungerly like he's out to prove his band's new direction>JB riff(Get On the Good Foot)>theme>outro chaos w/ brief Star Spangled Banner quote.

Caesar>somewhat extended version(11+) for a mostly linear jam>smoking blues pH a definite cousin of you know who?

Ghost>fast tempo(like the majority of new tunes played by most bands)>Mike brief low end scat>nice sounding funk in contrast(mostly in key although this one is in A same as Llama whereas both Gin and Sprach are in C)>upstroking Trey funks along, patience building sounding very collective>Fish rocking the ride setting up a nice tempo>rock riff w/ trippy Page>decanting into a blues theme>the blueprint fusing their funk sound w/ THeads/Green>cool riffs by Trey, soloing melodically back into I-IV>jam.

I know Trey solos compassionately w/ horns but no solos by Anastasio in FB>cool they got to play w/ a band they covered.

Conclusion:

I really like this show.  At first I wasn't terribly impressed by A's choice in that it didn't seem as obscure as the first two however I do believe that it deserves review.  This was their second to last show before the end of a 19 show run, the music a culmination of their tourly efforts.  The energy of this show is amazing as Aug stated>good choice.

Grade: A-

 
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 30, 2006, 12:22:05 AM
This is gonna sound surprising, but I actually enjoyed the second set to the first set.

Opening the second set is the WAY TOO LONG 2001.  This is the antithesis to the last 2001 we listened to here, and it is about a billion times less funky in my opinion.  Just because Trey uses a wah to accentuate the beat and Page jumps on the clavinet does not make it funkier.  This 2001 is at LEAST 3-5 minutes TOO LONG.   SNOOZE.  BORING.  Funny banter to begin the set tho, btw.  They must love playing in france, because the french shows have THE BEST stage banter.  Nice Star Spangled Banner quote at the end of the way too long 2001 from Trey to accentuate the banter.  I wonder how the lights were for this in a small club?  Btw, I think the perfect time limit for the 2001 is probably the 95-96 5-7 minute range.  Some stretching out...some TIGHT funk...but no boring spaces.  (I do happen to really dig on the 12/18/99 2001, because of the HUGE Frampton Jamming...but that's besides the point).

2001 leads into Julius.  Julius is always one of those tunes that I groan at when it starts, but by the end I have a SMILE on my face.  This Julius has some sweet ass Start-Stop slow funky r and b going on at the very end of the jam.  Some might prefer a HUGE julius ending, but I really did dig on this.  This would be a good one to play ont he beach during the summer time.  Great Julius...and it melts down into...

MAGILLA!!!! AND WHAT A HUGE MAGILLA IT IS!!!! This is a FANTASTIC Magilla.  Mike's solo is HUGE.  Great playing all around.  Blows down the Va. Beach Magilla that we got three weeks later (which I LOVED) away HANDS DOWN!!!  Goddamn this is the smokingest Magilla I've ever heard.  And it segues into!!!!

YAMAR!!! GREAT ANTICS!  GREAT YAMAR.  FUN FUN FUN.  I LOVE IT.  AND THEY'LL SUCK YOUR BLOOD TOO!  And huge Magilla teasing at the end!  I was hoping they might go back into another Magilla, but it wasn't to be.  Fun ass yamar.  I love hearing the boys have a great time in the small euro venues. 

And out of the Yamar jam comes GHOST!  Without the traditional '97 opening.  Great ghost.  I prefer a ghost like this WHOLESALE to one like the Amsterdam 97 ghost.  Great opening jam.  Great segue into a HORRIBLE RENDITION of take me to the river (they actually do try to play it, it just sucks).  This take me to the river reminds me of the horrendous take on low rider that the band did 11/23/97 in Winston.  Great Disease...horrible Low Rider.  Same here.  If you guys haven't heard 11/21/95, do so now.  They only do about a verse and a half...but the band PLAYS THE HELL out of take me to the river in the middle of an INSANE bowie.  The ending return to the Ghost jam is GREAT!  As is the band singing TAKE ME TO THE RIVER over the jam.  I like that, it's fun, and the band seems to recognize how shittily they covered Take Me To The River.  Great job guys.

What a fun set.  I definitely liked it more than the first set, because it was engaging and FUN.

Son Seals comes out and blows the roof off the place, which only sucks, because PAUL HAD HIS GUITAR SO FUCKING LOW IN THE MIX THAT NOBODY COULD HEAR HIM.  What in the fuck Paul?  Great version of funky bitch nonetheless (if the horns weren't too loud.).  So far, this has been my fave of the three shows (even tho the Hood is THE SHIT from the Fox) to listen to...and I hope this club doesn't die off (it seems like we keep dropping off in post count week after week).

Thanks august....and lets keep the reviews coming in!
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jedifunk on May 30, 2006, 12:57:01 AM
its only monday... we've got all week.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 30, 2006, 12:57:43 AM
Quote from: jedifunk on May 30, 2006, 12:57:01 AM
its only monday... we've got all week.

HELLS YEAH WE DO!   :banana:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: shoreline99 on May 30, 2006, 02:11:37 PM
yes, we do. i just ripped this show and stuck it in the car for later.  :banana:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: sls.stormyrider on May 30, 2006, 09:45:59 PM
The French love Jimi Hendrix and Danny Bonaduce :-)
Another fun show.
Set 1 -
it's all about Gin.
Dogs - good starter
LxL - always like this song, but i think it got better as time went on. RCMH 2000 comes to mind
Gin- what can I say - great funk jam. One of the things I like about this show is that there is a new twist on so may songs, this was the best
Lama - another good one. see ^
Velvet Sea - OK, I admit it. I like this song. Smite me if you wish. (I also like bouncin', Caspian, FEFY). Good placement, good transition into and out of. Trey has done a better, more majestic solo at the end in other versions, though
Lizard's jam - very cool
OP - fun way to end the set

Set 2 - this one kept growin on me. I liked it better than set 1. May not have been the best musically, but I was smiling the whole time. They were having fun and it showed.
2001- nice
Julius -another one that always hits it for me; haven't heard a version i didn't feel like just getting up and dancing. swinging jam, even if it is "type 1"
Magilla - loved it
Ya Mar - great jam, lots of fun. St Tropez (sonny rollins) tease near the end
ghost>river - loved the twist they put on ghost. i was imagining Herbie hancock up there with them for this. Great, but simple jam. Mike was definitely on this set
FB - agree with comment above - Son Seals' solo was hot, but you could hardly hear it. The horn player detracted from the tune.

Overall, fun show with lots of twists. Not quite as good as 7/2/97 but def a keeper. A-
thanks aug :phish:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: cactusfan on May 31, 2006, 03:04:22 PM
what i like most about this show is the vibe of the whole thing.
it's so relaxed and fun and full of a deep grooving funkiness.

every song is played through the prism of this vibe, so every song is changed.
i love when that happens.
and it's such a funky set!
look at all the songs NOT played:
reba
stash
bowie
mango
curtain
foam
and everything else that isn't straight up groove.

i don't know that any of these songs would come up as favorite versions for me, but with shows like this, that's not the point; it's the whole show as one 'thing' that makes it work so well.

whenever i hear shows with this kind of low-key vibe i always feel like i can hear each instrument so clearly. there's no 'wall of sound' moments anywhere in the show. it's not that the interplay of the instruments is any better than in a crazy rocking show, it's more that the relaxed nature of the playing allows you to hear every little moment. or something like that.

anyway.
gin is the highlight of set one. but the whole set works. the dogs limb ginseng opening works great, totally setting the vibe. it makes me want to sit on someone's porch at sunset with a fat joint and a glass of whiskey, you know?
then llama, but even llama they can't maintain-- they're too mellow and funked out, so they turn it into a groovy jam, then chill things out (as if they needed chilling) with velvet sea, and then they just jam for awhile before upping the intensity for all of three minutes w/ oblivious fool to close it out.

set two starts out right where they left off, totally fun and mellow. they don't know what to play, so they just play and it turns into 2001.
which in this show, played in this way, is the IDEAL length. little 3 minute rocker versions of this song are fine for rocking '93 shows, but man would that ever sound out of place in a show like this. i love how this 2001 just funks along without a worry in the world.
julius is awesome. again, it's just a totally different song from what it normally is, because the vibe of the night demands it.
i love how it goes into magilla. i'm definitely in a rocking chair on that porch, well into my second whiskey now.
the ya mar jam is so fun. foot stomping!
and the way it segues into ghost is so nice, and so unusual. the rhythym of ghost is very different, especially in the beginning of the song. i like this jam basically until 8 or 9 minutes in, when trey switches on the rock.
for me, this is where the show ends. ghost goes on with the take me to the river bit, but this all feels totally uninspired to me.
though i do like the encore. too bad about the guitar being so low, but otherwise a nice way to finish things.

this show isn't my favorite of this tour but still i love it.
shows with this kind of unified feel are just fun to listen to.
who wouldn't wish they were at this one? (was anyone?)

so thanks for giving me a reason to pull this show out again.
it's been way too long since i last heard it.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: antelope19 on May 31, 2006, 03:41:39 PM
7/10/97: Marseille, France

What can I say, this has been a favorite of mine since project '97.  Its all about the Gin here.  I would have to disagree with fauxpax, no offense, but I love 2001 and IMO there isn't one that exists out there that is "too long".  But thats just my $.02. I love the lizards jam, you can't really tell what it is until late.  Unfortunatley, I have the version with tracks listed as SICK FUNK JAM #1, how obnoxious.  Nevertheless, I love this show everytime I listen to it.  The Transition from Julius into Magilla is a favorite of mine, extra smooth and jazzy and I like Mikes little solo in there.  The Yamar is fun, and the Boys really seem to be enjoying themselves.  Is it me, or does it seem sometimes that Trey and Mike really try to F with each other during this song to try and make each other screw up and laugh?  Vampire Child?  :-D  I know I probably couldn't have kept a straight face.  Great Jams all around, the crowd seems to be lovin' it and who can blame them.  Def. one of my favorites of '97(which actually isn't saying much because I like so many of the shows from '97).  Oh ya, and any time you get to hear Phish play Funky Bitch with Son Seals is A OK in my book. :beers: 
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: shoreline99 on May 31, 2006, 03:49:05 PM
Without repeating what has been said before, I would like to just add that the permeation of the gin throughout the first set is as good as tanqueray through tonic and ice cubes. Love the lizards jam and WITVS as well.

Second set is where the boys get the groove on. Good stage banter, killer julius. Great Magilla/Ya Mar/Ghost/River, and I have to agree that Son Seals' guitar is too low in the mix. Not sure if this is the best show of this run, but i'd give it a solid B+/A- for the energy alone.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: whatapiper on June 01, 2006, 03:22:58 AM
still havnt had a chance to listen...been busy with work :frustrated:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: VA $l!m on June 01, 2006, 03:17:40 PM
well, it took a few days, but i think i listened to the whole thing... actually pretty short show.
I.
Dogs stole-- i like this choice for an opener; though it prob wouldnt fly in this spot once it was better known. set the tonew for the show in my mind though.

LimByLimb-- alright, 1st off i personally dislike this soing w/out the Chinese wall part; it just seems a little noodley to me, though this version is decent, and Trey steps up, and starts to take his place as the leader of the show in general.

Ginseng-- nice placement, continues the mood set with Dogs, this the "dope-Yest" of the Bluegrass tunes IMO...

Bathtub-- OK, lets start the show!!
nice version... somewhat old school, in my mind, lots of goofin around, not a straight Gin...
this is the point in the show where i noticed my one major gripe w/ this show as a whole though-- Page's Equipment-- as far as i can tell-- correct me if i'm wrong-- he is using only a synth for all his sounds, not the organ, piano, maybe there is a real rhodes, moog, clavi-- not sure, but to me they all sound like a synth... bugged the hell out of me for the rest of the show-- especially once
>>>
LLama hit... the lack of a real Hammond B3 was crucial, but
very hot funk grooves throughout battub> LLAma...
then i was tired and i have to admit i skipped sailin the seas of cheese...

Lizards jam continued the old school fun funkin around vibe-- cool...
Oblivious Fool... i like this song when its called shafty...cant stand it with this music.

II.
2001... great shit, again the synth bugged me,,, but sweet version-- to the point, no more no less.
Julius... great placement... nice version of a song that i often dislike... good shit

.... rest of the set--- great, loved it, MIKE was jammin more this set, great play between him and TREy- who i thought was the star of the first set... seemed short, like there should be another song or two after take me to the river, but also seemed appropriate for the small club type sounding vibe i was getting... i really had an impression of them loving playing this gig  to a smaller audioence like theyt were back in the day w/ no worries...
encore...different/ cool.

overall... 7.3 on slim's 10 pt scale.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on June 01, 2006, 03:24:53 PM
I don't know if you are talking in general...but during the opening...page was definitely on a full size piano...he brought his full set up with them to Europe.

During the jam the parts that sound like a "synth" are in fact the Moog (an analog type of synthesizer...the rock band "Air" uses them alot) and  the Clavinet (an electric piano that sounds like plucking a guitar, it's the keyboard sound heard on "Frankenstein" very predominately...and is also used by John Medeski in his jams as a counterpoint to his Hammond organ).

Also, I realized that some of the "lazer beam" sounds that sound like they are synth sounds coming from Page, are in fact coming from Mike's bass.  Listen to the "Yamar" when Trey calls out for just Mike and Fish...Mike lets out some nasty ass "lazer beam" licks...I don't know if he had it running through a Moogerfooger....some type of stand alone synth...or what...but it is a pretty wicked sound to have come from the bass.

But yes, Page did have his piano there (just not used during the Gin jam).

And yes, Page did have his Hammond there as well.  That is definitely not a synthesized organ.

A rhodes sounds VASTLY differant than both of those...and he doesn't use a rhodes very often.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: VA $l!m on June 01, 2006, 03:39:01 PM
well, i def. don't need the equipment lecture... i'm a keyboardist by trade... but thanks...
if you have definitve proof this is his normal setup, then i guess the only possiblily that what i'm hearing is the PA mix or somethin else in the production...... uh, honestly i'd like to be prooven wrong, so i could go back and listen again... he definitely was f---ing around on the moog more than usual, maybe thats what was throwing me off.
oh well, page was annoying me in general then if i'm wrong on the equipment thing, maybe he just wasnt in the pocket as much as i would like. :| :| :|
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on June 01, 2006, 03:55:46 PM
Quote from: VA slim on June 01, 2006, 03:39:01 PM
well, i def. don't need the equipment lecture... i'm a keyboardist by trade... but thanks...
if you have definitve proof this is his normal setup, then i guess the only possiblily that what i'm hearing is the PA mix or somethin else in the production...... uh, honestly i'd like to be prooven wrong, so i could go back and listen again... he definitely was f---ing around on the moog more than usual, maybe thats what was throwing me off.
oh well, page was annoying me in general then if i'm wrong on the equipment thing, maybe he just wasnt in the pocket as much as i would like. :| :| :|

The mix does sound pretty bad, and as far as definitive proof is concerned, I'm looking for pictures on phish.com right now to show you that he did indeed have his full settup.

I wasn't trying to lecture you, only trying to say that you were wrong :P

J/K...I wasn't trying to be a dick in my response, I worded it lengthily because I wasn't sure myself, so I went back and listened to both the Gin and the Llama.  And I wanted to explain why I thought what I thought more than just saying YOU'RE WRONG!

One of my biggest complaints with pre-93 phish is that the electric piano sounds like BULLSHIT to me.  And this show definitely sounds like a real piano to me.  It could be synthed...but I don't think it is.  I will admit that page is not as prominent as he could be in the mix...I think it is because they are playing a small club and not an amphitheatre.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on June 01, 2006, 03:58:31 PM
THE ONLY STAGE SHOT THEY HAVE FROM EUROPE 97 IS OF EVERYONE BUT PAGE  :frustrated:

Ok, I don't have conclusive proof that the piano was there...but Phish's "TMIPH" for June '97 talks extensively about the summer 97 tour... nowhere does it mention missing equipment (and it seems that Trey, Mike and Fish have their full equipment setups at the time)...but it does say that at the Fourth Ball show that the band had to play their practice equipment because their road equipment was already shipped over to europe. 

Also, they played Loving Cup at least once which intimates (to me) that Page had a grand piano with him, because the reason Loving Cup was not debuted live until 93 was that Page was waiting for a real piano to play it live (he was quoted as saying that sometime in '92).  So, I think that the circumstantial evidence points to their full setup being used.

The 98 european tour, on the other hand, featured the band using rented equipment from night to night...
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: VA $l!m on June 01, 2006, 08:18:40 PM
looks like we have a contest to find pics on our hands-- :banana:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: VA $l!m on June 01, 2006, 09:00:55 PM
well i googled the topic in question for pics, and found some from the tour-- not this nite specifically, but Page had his full setup, so... anyway, back to your normal programming.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: fauxpaxfauxreal on June 01, 2006, 11:35:19 PM
Quote from: VA slim on June 01, 2006, 09:00:55 PM
well i googled the topic in question for pics, and found some from the tour-- not this nite specifically, but Page had his full setup, so... anyway, back to your normal programming.

Ok, I thought he did.  Sorry you were wrong  :cry:.

PSYCHE

IN YO FACE :P
:samurai:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: Hicks on June 01, 2006, 11:37:16 PM
Quote from: whatapiper on June 01, 2006, 03:22:58 AM
still havnt had a chance to listen...been busy with work :frustrated:

Ditto, and add in weddings and graduations with the work. 
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jephrey on June 02, 2006, 05:48:22 PM
I hope to get to it over the weekend, then on with the next on Monday eh?

:phish:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: birdman on June 02, 2006, 07:29:31 PM
Finally got around to listening to the first set today. Work has been overwhelming me :frustrated:
   Anyway...First up...Dogs Stole. I love this song and I like it best early in the first set, so I was more than pleased with this version.
Limb...interesting due to it being an early version. nothing unusual here.
Ginseng...Another one of my favorite short tunes. I like the way the song matured after 96...tighter, more energetic delivery.
      Now...Gin. Really quite a phenomenal version..maybe not top ten but certainly the reason to listen to this first set again. Goes somenice places without to much noodling. Really a solid version especially when Llama pops up next.\
   Llama is really over the top...reminds me of 94 versions, almost careening out of control. The jam comes out of nowhere...anyone else hear hints of Weekapaug in this jam..listen to mikes Bass lines around the 5 minute mark. Sounds just like a 92ish Weekapaug jam. Or am I just crazy?
   Velvet is a nice cool down tune..like how the delay loops intertwine in the song. I seem to like this song nowadays more than ever. When they first debuted it I though it was so out of character. But now I feel differently.
   The lizards jam is alot of fun and very unique.
  Oblivious fool should fade away into oblivion
 
  Cant wait to hear set two if the Gin is a sign of things to come...
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: sophist on June 02, 2006, 10:56:28 PM
got the 1st set playing on the ipod right now.  I'll have my comments up tomorrow.   :beers:

Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: whatapiper on June 03, 2006, 04:20:23 AM
ok, still havnt listened to the whole show yet, most of set one...hopefully by tommorrow night i will finish.

set I is up and down for me, the boyz are tryin out the new tunes, with a very fresh feel to em. 

dogs stole= never really been a fan, but the solo can be quite nice, this one didnt do it for me.
limbxlimb= nice early version that shows this song will go places in the future...
ginseng= i love some bluegrass, page always excites me...
bathtub= love this version, the jam is kinda forced/sloppy in the beggining imo, but just gets nasty, you can really here what 97 is gonna be all about.  this gin has "it", the sound that made me feel apart of something magical during the 16 97's i was fortunate enough to see...
llama= this llama rips! nice funk taboot!!!
velvet sea= check notes on dirt, this was better than dirt imo, every time i hear this song i think about coventry...
jam?= thats as far as ive listened, i try not to look at the setlists and just let the set unravel itself like i was hearing it for the 1st time...

anyway, i cant wait to get to the 2nd set on my way to work tommorow! :-D

:phish:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: thelot on June 03, 2006, 10:07:25 AM
Wait a minute they played Dirt :?

I actually listened to this show last month. Highlights for me were...
Gin> (incredible version!)
Llama> (ditto!)
Velvet Sea>
Lizards Jam (very cool!)
Olivia's Pool (I've loved this song ever since 7-29-97, my first introduction to x and '97 phunk :-o)
2001> :banana:
Julius (not a big fan of this song, but this version rocked.)
Magilla (fun version)
Ya Mar (very playful...I likey)
Ghost (nice version)
Take Me to the River (nice outro jam)
Funky Bitch (good version, I think I would've enjoyed it more if Seals was a little higher in the mix)

Nice Summer Europe show I give it a 4 out of 5.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on June 03, 2006, 10:16:34 AM
Quote from: thelot on June 03, 2006, 10:07:25 AM
Wait a minute they played Dirt :?

a?

:wink:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: sophist on June 03, 2006, 10:30:18 AM
1st set is solid, the gin is good.  2nd set is where the meat is at.  Good pick aug.  I like the funk in this show, very dark and tasty. 
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: whatapiper on June 03, 2006, 02:07:21 PM
dogs stole, dirt, same song right? :roll:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: sophist on June 03, 2006, 11:14:02 PM
alright the ghost is nasty.  I gave it another spin.  I like the yamar -> jam
very solid second set.  The first set has its moments, but the second shows why phish is phish  :phish:
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: whatapiper on June 04, 2006, 03:54:48 AM
so ive gotten as far as the intro to ghost.

i liked the lizards jam in set one, def unexpected, when i got in my car thats when the lizard licks started comin...very nice.
oblivous fool= i really dig this song, nice version

set II
2001= always a nice way to get some groove goin and set the mood for the 2nd set...
Julius= great version! extended ending with some phunk and jamz
magilla and ya mar were sick! you can really tell everyone is having a great time.
ghost...to be continued.
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: Hicks on June 05, 2006, 10:44:40 PM
OK, finally made it through the first set so here goes.

Dog Stole Things:  It's never been my favorite, but it was pretty cool to hear out of Tweezer at the Gorge in 03 and somehow driving in my car listening to this on a nice summer evening it was the perfect soundtrack for the moment.  Nice opener. 

Limb By Limb:  I think this is a great song, one of the best in terms of songwriting for Phish's post '95 output.  Listening to this my mind went back to the recent conversation of the history of this song's placement, and I think that this is near perfect setlist position for the tune.  It doesn't really work as an opener, in fact I'm not sure if they ever even played it as an opener, but in the number two position here it works as a great bridge to get into the meat of the set.  The laid back short jam is also a perfect warm up for things to come.  Short but sweet and perfectly placed.

Ginseng Sullivan:  :banana:

Bathtub:  Like others have said here's where the action really starts.  Trey has some pretty nasty dirty tone goin' on here before the delay and I mean that in a good way.  Then things get funky like only 97 can, I really enjoyed the sped up Ghost jam and I thought Trey did a nice job of bringing it back to the Gin theme.  Not in the same league as stuff like 11/23/97, 7-29-98 or even 7-9-03, but a great Gin nonetheless.

Llama: Amazing version!  I love when they take a tune like this that is usually by the numbers and take it out for a spin.  For me the level of improv here is the highlight of the set, Page is laying down some funky noises and Mike sounds like he's having fun with that acid effect on his bass, and Trey does a nice job of laying low to let Mike and Page have some fun.  It might not be saying much but this is one of the best Llamas I've ever heard. 

Velvet Sea:  Hmmm. . . Llama>Jam>Velvet Sea, sounds like they were trying to capture some of the magic of the previous week's show in Amsterdam, they don't top it but the sequence is still very enjoyable.  Velvet Sea is a great tune, totally underrated, and I love the conciseness of this version. 

Lizards Jam:  Reggae Lizards Jam, hells yeah!!  I detected the Lizards rift at about the five minute mark, with it becoming really obvious at about the six minute mark and the crowd responds accordingly.  Very fun off the cuff jam, and it fits in well with the laid back nature of the set.  This reminds me, anyone else think Trey was playing the Lizards rift during the HYHU segment of Tweezer on 8-11-04, I suspect he was.

Oblivious Fool/ Olivia's Pool:  Not my favorite, I think the decision to rework into Shaft was a good one, but who can really argue with a two and a half minute first set closer.

All in all an enjoyable solid B+ first set, hopefully I can listen to Set II before the end of the summer!
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: August on June 05, 2006, 10:54:42 PM
as for limb by limb openers....

6-19-97
7-26-97
6-30-98
7-9-99
12-8-99
6-16-00

its good to get it out of the way..  :wink:
a
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: susep on June 05, 2006, 10:55:01 PM
Quote from: ikki on June 05, 2006, 10:44:40 PM
Limb Listening to this my mind went back to the recent conversation of the history of this song's placement, and I think that this is near perfect setlist position for the tune.  It doesn't really work as an opener, in fact I'm not sure if they ever even played it as an opener, but in the number two position here it works as a great bridge to get into the meat of the set. 

06-19-97 Arena, Vienna, Austria

1: Limb By Limb, Dogs Stole Things, Theme From the Bottom*-> Punch You in the Eye, Water in the Sky, Maze, Waste, Vultures, Runaway Jim

2: Stash-> Ghost-> I Saw It Again, Wading in the Velvet Sea, Piper, Jesus Just Left Chicago, Prince Caspian

E: Beauty of My Dreams, Character Zero, Hello My Baby#

*With "The Landlady" tease (including dance by Trey and Mike).  #No mics.

Nice Aug

In the above mentioned show Stash has a jam similar to the 30Nov.97 version.

Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jephrey on June 06, 2006, 12:13:54 AM
I just finished set 1 myself...  I agree with Bathtub being where it started, and I liked it a lot.  Llama didn't do it for me though, the jam sounded more forced.  I thought Velvet sea was good there and I definitely liked the Lizards jam.

But that's just me.  Set 2 to follow...

Jephrey
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: Hicks on June 06, 2006, 02:33:56 AM
Quote from: august on June 05, 2006, 10:54:42 PM
as for limb by limb openers....

6-19-97
7-26-97
6-30-98
7-9-99
12-8-99
6-16-00

its good to get it out of the way..  :wink:
a

There you go, I've even heard two of them.   :-D

And yeah 6-19-97 is a great Stash!
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: jephrey on June 07, 2006, 04:37:29 PM
Also Sprach Zarathustra -> Really liked this one
Julius, rockin'
Magilla -> Ya Mar* Cool.  Good interplay
Ghost -> Take Me To The River.  I love the funk
E: Funky Bitch*  Good to hear with Son Seals' band I like these

Show overall, B+ IMO.

I was early 97 so the funk wasn't as thick and easy flowing as it could.  There were definite highlights however.  I'm on to this week's assignment.

Jephrey
Title: Re: Week 3: 7-10-97 Marseille, France
Post by: Hicks on June 08, 2006, 08:43:26 PM
OK, I know you've all been dying to hear my set II review so here it is:

Great opening banter on this one, love the Bonaduce/Partridge Family comments.  I always thought it was strange that the band pretty much stopped talking to the crowd on a regular basis in 98-99.  How bizarre was it that the band said nothing over the entire ending run at Shoreline in 2000, they didn't even announce Bobby when he took or left the stage!  Anyway, stuff like this is priceless and I wish it was a part of more shows from 98 on. 

2001:  Fairly standard version, which means nice and funky.  Some good work by Mike and at least one buzzkilling flub by Trey but other than that nothing too notable.

Julius: I think it's a good tune myself, and it was never overplayed so nobody has any reason to hate.  This is an above average version I would say, slightly extended and Trey plays some pretty hot blues leads when they break it down toward the end. 

Magilla:  I'm surprised nobody brought up the truly awful clapping during this one, man those Euros really love "the clap", too bad they are no good at it!  (Sorry Mopper if I offend  :wink:)  Anyway, good selection here, this is a bustout for 97 no?  Very cool to hear the band in full jazz mode this late in the game, since that became so rare.  Nice work by Leo of course, but I think Trey is particularly tasty here giving Gordo room to solo and just totally switching over to that other jazzy mode of playing guitar effortlessly.  Fishman's attempt at latin percussion here is pretty funny.  It seemed to me they were toying with the idea of going into Sanity during the rave ups at the end, but instead . . .

Ya Mar:  But they haven't gotten any Sanity style wackiness out of their systems yet so this ends up being a version chock full of schtick and is a really fun listen.   Nothing too crazy musically, but still good, Trey's solo takes on a jazzy feel again and he acknowledges it with a Magilla tease, he might be teasing something else after this but I'm not sure.  Then a pretty smooth segue into. . .

Ghost:  Starts off really quiet which is novel and yeah they rush the tempo too, I think Trey's vocals on this are a little better than usual, more soul than I'm used to from him.  Sure this one's funky, but they clearly hadn't unlocked the potential of the tune yet.  Mike's high pitched bass effect is cool and very YEM-ish to me, other than that not too much to write home about.  Trey hits a kind of monotonous chugging groove and they segue into. . .

Take Me to the River:  I don't know man, at first with the boring groove and Trey's bad vocals I hated this.  But somehow by the end of it, it won me over.  They could've have easily gone into Free in the middle there, but instead they break it down a Trey busts out more tasty quiet blues licks, very nice!  Somehow with the spacey jam in there and the soul infused reprise at the end this ends up being the highlight of the set for me, go figure!  I was pretty surprised that was the end of the show, but whateves I'm sure it had been a tiring tour for them.

The encore sounds like absolute dook on my source, so I won't comment further.

Overall a solid B set, a bit short and no monster jams to speak of, but a cool jazz/blues vibe dominates the set and creates a coherent mood which is always a bonus.  I have to give set I the edge here, just because there's more substance and notable versions of songs:  Gin and Llama specifically.  Still a solid B+ show overall, and a really fun listen. 

I fired this one up on the big system in the basement, which I need to do more often, and I absolutely love the way these Euro 97s sound!  You can really hear how small the rooms they played were, and I really dig the way Leo is going nuts on his synths in pratically every show, they give all the shows a similar style that's almost immediately identifiable.  I still gotta say 7/2 is the king of the run, and I would nominate 6/20 for a dark horse, I really dug that one the other day. 

Excellent choice Aug, now I'm on to 12/9!