week4paug.net

ok here it is...

this weeks show is......... 8/7/93.
http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=25232



Discuss

Quote from: august on May 16, 2006, 10:47:43 PM
i will try to get the show up tonight in mp3 form via sendspace...
stay tuned...
a

Hey guys, sorry about the thread jack, but Cleech is having a tough time getting logged back on and this thread has had the most activity lately.  He was having this problem right before week4paug went on "hiatus" and he still is having the problem...can one of you help out?  He asked me to PM jedi and/or tet.  Any advice?

tell him i baned him because he is trying to overthrow the Daily Download with his own...

seriously, i spoke to him about this this morning i dunno....  :?
a

looking to see what i can do right now...

Thanks guys,

Carry on!
Sweet dreams to me...

Dee

here is 8-7-93 Set I

http://www.sendspace.com/file/8i2tqu

i will have set II up by the morn.
a

Sweet idea guys, I've got the jump on y'all since I just listened to this one last week, but since it's one of my favorites, I'll give it another listen tomorrow morning! 

And Jedi, you might change your mind about archiving it after you give it a listen!  :wink:

so far im very impressed, the first set rages! tons of energy, like i said in the other thread, im listening to the AKG FOB which is SICK.  great recording.   ok, so far a very solid, rage fill3d and tight Llama opener.  bouncin is bouncin but tight nonetheless.  poor heart has some great work from page.  where the set heats up though is that stash. it has this trey driven "rise", which is the only way i can describe it.  great, great stash, very tight and unique.   reba i need to give a re-listen, i was tryin to figuere out how to make my pics smaller for the "post a pic of you" thread.  i liked the maze intro with whistling, how hard would that be? :-o 

so, i dont listen to much pre 97 either, not that i dont love/appreciate it, i just gravitate to yrs i saw alot of shows, and which happen to be epic yrs(97-98).  this will be a great way to reinvent myself with earlier phish, the years that got me into them in the first place.

gotta love a solid famous mockingbird, trey just floats across the neck.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/ic91xt

set II

a

8-7-93
Darien Lake, NY

First off, this is a great idea! I hope that many of us can come together and listen to these shows and be subjective.
If this is a weekly thing, maybe we can have the official "new show" announcement on Monday's???? Get your week going strong, perhaps?
Anyway, what i did for this is made a list of the set and made comments next to each.
That way, i devote my full attention to each tune.
Also, i volunteer myself to up the Mp3's for each show (if i have them).i think that is agreat alternative to those that dont want to download the entire show or it is not currently available on etree.
on to the show highlights for me......

llama,bouncing,poor heart- all played well.the solo for trey in poor heart was not one of his best, but still ripped.i would love it if he still had those bluegrass chops.

stash-a little part of the compose section wa shakey, but that was about it.really great jam.has summer 93 written all over it.i liked how they were going towards the end then went back into the jam section where they were......i liked how it was unfinished and went in to...

makisupa-btw, this recording is insane!i kept thinking that this had to be a matrix, because it just sounded like a board but was faintly chatty in the right channel.i listened with headphones and there were alot of parts were some guys were yapping away... :roll:
the rim shots were so nice sounding on this.....and trey was using an effect that had a reverse on his slapback......truly awesome effect and makisupa.very fast.

reba-solid version.great jam, but what did you expect? unfinished....or not....

maze- with reba whistling in the intro...nice! although page missed the first chords at the end of his solo, they recovered well from it.trey tore his section apart.great version.

forbin/mockingbird-cool version and narration.not too over the top, but real nice.

cavern closer....

2001- holy shit i called it! anyway, typical 93 version, although better than the july's.

mikes->kung->mikes- some secret language going on....definitely cool, but not completely mindblowing. the kung was great, but the mikes wasnt doing too much for me.it seemed forced in a way for them to be overly creative........imo

mws->avenu->sloth-great! and yes, the transition into the sloth is great.i loved when they still had setlists.for those that dont know, they ditched writing a setlist for each show right before fall 97 ........anyway, the sloth is one of my favs...real nasty version.

sparkle,my friend- nice my friend (my fav phish tune).i ma glad i caught one with the acoustic intro......no laughing ending, just a simple little fade out which was cool.

mcgrupp- great version! i like when they all get involved in the middle "page Jam" section. before the band comes back in,page is hitting some walls of the cave type progressions......this one was also unfinished...

purple rain-koo

antelope- typical 93 rippage.real solid.

carolina/la grange- mike is great on this la grange.they busted this out on 8-2-93 after not playing it for 302 shows!kickdown!they played it once more later in the week then shelved it untill 12-29-95!

great show!
i give it a solid B+
this is what summer 93 is all about.

so no reba ending, no stash ending,no hydrogen or weekapaug, no second MWS, no my friend ending and no McGrupp ending.....hmmmmmmmmmmmm....  :roll:

a

I'm doing this...  Into bouncing right now.

Earbuds at work, had to use the EQ and turn up the bass.

Thoughts to follow this afternoon or tomorrow.

Thanks for the mp3s aug.

Jephrey

quick question for aug... are the sendspace mp3s entire sets or individual songs?  not that it matters...

i'm home sick today :( so i should have plenty of time to listen and respond

I loved this show! High energy, rages. Page is a wild man.

I'll give my highlights and try not be be too redundant.

Llama: Really like the way most of treys solo was long notes instead of the shredding I am used to hear with this one.

Stash: What can I say? did they do an extra line in the intro? Great jam - just when you thought they were going to return to the theme and end it - surprise! nice transisition to MP. Did I miss the ending to stash - yes, but Phish is all about doing something unexpected

Reba - nailed it. almost perfect. surprise ending with whistling in maze was cool

Maze-another hot one. I thought I heard Trey teasing a line from Jimmy Page's solo in Stairway to Heaven about 5:50

McGrupp - very nice, loved Page

Mikes > The epitome of summer 93. Just doing crazy shit for fun.

my friend - nice acoustic intro

Antelope - classic summer 93 with Trey rippin' Page going wild in the background. There are better versions, but this is very good.

I would give it an A.

the mikes didnt do it for me either...

Quote from: jedifunk on May 17, 2006, 11:53:55 AM
quick question for aug... are the sendspace mp3s entire sets or individual songs?  not that it matters...

i'm home sick today :( so i should have plenty of time to listen and respond

they are each complete set in a zip folder.
so they are individual songs once you extract it.

set two has the encore as well.
feel betta!
a

First off, huge 1993 fan here, it's always an internal debate over whether I like 93 better than 97, although it's really an apples, oranges thing.

I just love how in 93 shows you actually can hear them discovering the techniques and elements that make them the incredible band they ultimately became.  To me listening to 93 shows is kind of like having a front row seat to history in the making, because in a way this is where THE Phish began, I would say this year is the first where we are actually listening to "modern Phish", rather than Phish the college band or Phish the bar band.  They were making leaps and bounds during many of these shows, and for me this is one of those shows.

So the first three songs are well played, but for me the show really starts with . . .

Stash, I absolutely love this version.  What struck me this morning is how restrained Trey actually is throughout this version.  Listen to how quietly he plays his notes during the clapping segment.  Then at the beginning of the jam he just plays a simple three note pattern, leaving Page room to do some nice runs up and down the keyboard.  The three note pattern turns into four notes, then five, until eventually he's going nuts and the crescendo back into the composed outro is some ecstatic peak Phish for me, and I think the way he took his time building the jam is near perfection. The crowd goes wild and Trey is absolutely wailing until unexpectedly they bring it back down for. . .

Makisupa, nothing too crazy, but I love how even way back then they were already doing ambient layering effects in songs like this, of course since this is 93 it morphs quickly into Reba.  Another thing I love about 93 is that it's short attention span Phish, don't like a jam or song?  Wait 30 seconds it'll change up!  :-D

Reba, don't have too much to say about this one just your typical 93 near perfection.   :wink:

But I do love they way they do the whistling over the Maze intro.  My favorite Phish segues remind me of crossfaded DJ mixes and this one gives me that feeling big time, Reba really is "mixed" into Maze. 

Maze, at this point you've got to be noticing that this set is a scorcher, Bouncin' is the only potential "break" song here and how can you really argue with it in the second position in the first set?  This is a hot Maze, again Trey's solo sounds very concise to me, no wasted notes, and no fumbling around trying to find the right note like I've heard him do on some later versions, he nails the peak perfectly, as he always did back then.  A pretty fast Maze for 93 as well.

Forbin's>Mockingbird, are you kidding me?  If they played all these songs in a first set anytime after 96 people would have sh*t themselves!  I love this narration, up there with some of my other favorites like 12-30-93, 12-31-92, 9-30-00 etc. 

Typical (fun) Cavern closer, with nice little runs from Trey between verses.

All in all incredible first set, it doesn't get much better than this, oh wait actually it does in set II . .  .

jedi..
maybe we can make that first post of your the Master Thread?

have each weeks selection-with the name of the selector along with the
sendspace links for the show.

and up top could always be...This Week's Pick....

whaddaya think?
a

I havent checked the other post where the idea was generated, but it makes me really happy that you guys chose to actually do 8/7/93.  It just feels mad cool that now all these people are taking the time to check out a show that i've adored and wanted other people to hear ever since i first started listening to Phish. 

For me, this show is all about the 2nd set Kung>Mike's Reprise.  Its just so badass how they go from the Kung weirdness right back into Mike's Hose Rage.  ahhh i love it

Great idea folks...

I really like this show, and when I want to hear something from this month, I usually pick this up along with a couple of others.  Stash, for me, is the highlight of the show.  It is a great second set, and I, too, like the Reba (better than 8/12/93 imo), but I always listen to this Stash repeatedly whenever this show is in rotation...

Again, great idea...looking forward to the next installment!

Quote from: Gumbo72203 on May 17, 2006, 01:27:59 PM
I havent checked the other post where the idea was generated, but it makes me really happy that you guys chose to actually do 8/7/93.  It just feels mad cool that now all these people are taking the time to check out a show that i've adored and wanted other people to hear ever since i first started listening to Phish. 

thats what it is all about!
great show!
A

Just finished listening to Set 1. Props to Page!

Llama is just llama, a reliable beast for the band to ride on and get things going.

Nice walking bass lines for Bouncin'

Poor Heart - I LOVE that song. And so does my little boy. We danced around, and danced, and danced, and I had to repeat the song three times  Hey, he's mad about Mike. Good for him.

Stash is still a grower at this stage. But man, this one gets pretty big around the 9 minute mark!

Makisupa Policeman - nothing special.

Maze lacked punch IMO.

Reba rolls and tumbles. No real risks, but solid. The composed sections are ... well .. composed

Col. Forbin's Ascent. It takes off, the band is climbing along with the subjec matter.

I want that Rollercoaster book that Fishman supposedly had! Great narration by Trey and then straight into Fly Famous Mockingbird.

Cavern is always a good choice before intermission. Hit the bar and get into a conversation of what Set II is going to be.

(will let you know tomorrow - now I am gonna watch the European club teams final - Barcelona vs. Arsenal - Dutchmen on both sides, so I will always come up a winner)

Ok, I too have just finished listening to the first set... And I have to say this is a fun little first set.  I don't know if anyone was at the Darien Lake show for this one (I assume not, because nobody has said as much).  But, I assume that this was an outdoor show where they solely utilized the pavilion without a lawn.  Seems like an intimate crowd, since there isn't much crowd noise (except for the bouncin' clapper  :roll:)  This is a great sounding FOB that opens in explosive fashion with Llama.  Llama presses depresses taboot taboot.  And you can tell this is going to be a fun show... nice little jam...nothing too wild... nothing too crazy.  And Bouncin' follows it up.  I don't know why Bouncin' gets so much hate, because it fucking rocks.  Nine times out of ten, I would rather hear a 3 minute Bouncing than a 30 minute Jibboo.  Bouncing has great lyrics, a great melody a good beat and sounds really good.  Great song.  If Trey's pop songs all sounded like Bouncing... I might actually like Shine :)  And then all of a sudden we get a Stash.  Stash was one of my original "favorite" phish tunes.  And was a great great tune that peaked too soon.  In 93, it smoked, however, and this one doesn't dissapoint.  The jam is dissonantly dizzily melodic and the band is hitting it on all cylinders.  I think the segue kind of hurt the tune however, and would have preffered a climatic huge ending.  This stash had so much potential and kind of just petered out into Makisupa.  Nobody so far has mentioned the Stash vocals tease during the Makisupa, which I thought was very very cute. 

The true star of this set is the Reba.  Man, that is a GREAT Reba.  It isn't "over the top".  But, it sounds GORGEOUS.  The band hits the jam with everything they got.  Effortlessly and egolessly.  I will definitely keep this Reba around.  I like it.  I like it alot.  Reba just sounds so nice.  The segue into maze is "cute", but doesn't really sound "good".  The whistling actually sounds really shitty.  I don't like it musically, but I think it's funny as hell.  For those that like this kind of segue into maze, definitely check out the Lake Placid 1995 Bouncing-->Maze.  The beginning of Maze features the ending triplet solo from Bouncing looped and superimposed over the opening Maze drumbeat, and it sounds sweet as hell.  One of my favorite Maze openings ever.  Maze is maze, and a good version at that. 

I love Forbins.  This version doesn't dissapoint.  Good tune, flawlessly played.  The narration, in my opinion, is really really lame.  Lamest Forbins narration I've heard.  It just doesn't make any sense in the context of the tune.  I like rollercoasters...but yeah... the narration was silly.  This is, I think MY FAVORITE MOCKINGBIRD.  Mockingbird is hit PERFECTLY.  I love the ending part.  And Trey FLYS THROUGH his arpeggios.  This is the kind of Mockingbird that makes me love Phish.  Good Mockingbird.

And then the set closes out with Cavern.  Good, evil version.  Me likes it.

All in all the first set is tight, but not outrageous.  I think it's an averagely good first set.  A couple of highlights...but nothing too far over the top.  The segues look good on paper, but sound kind of forced and detract from the vibe and music at the show...

But, the Reba and Mockingbird SMOKE!

you really dont like the narration Faux?  I think its wonderful; one of the few narrations ive heard that actually take you for a ride (no pun intended).  Pack up a bongload, sit back and close your eyes, and you can actually feel yourself on the rollercoaster, guided by Trey's voice and the genius backing music (Fish's snare click-clack is perfect). 

I'm glad you like the Reba though.  I too believe this to be one of the most beautiful Reba's ever, right up there with 11/20/92 (the only Reba jam, or Phish jam period, where Trey actually successfully manages to make his guitar sound like its actually weeping or crying....  so sick)

My notes...

Llama - Hot as always.  Not much special with this one.  I wasn't thougoughly impressed
Bouncing - Not a favorite of mine.  Well played, but pretty standard, really.
Poor Heart - I never look for this song on paper, but it's always good to hear.  Not Trey's best solo but very good.  I love how fast the guitar gets.  That's skillz.
Stash - It's set apart because of the lack of ending, and I liked the jam.  I liked the > Makisupa, but it sounded planned.  And that's OK, but it makes it less special.
Makisupa - I was really pleased with this version.  I always like the song, but I think this one went over well.
Reba - Typically awesome.
Maze - Cool how the whistling was brought into the intro.  Makes it notable.  It's good, but that's it.
Forbin's > Mockingbird - I personally liked the narration.  Forbins is always a treat, and I'm always amazed at how the guys play the narration backdrop.
Cavern - Typical closer and I like it there.  This version was above average IMO.

2001 - Great set opener, but short and standard
Mike's - Pretty HOT.
Irish ditty - this is fantastic.
Kung - I liked this Kung.  I'm usually less of a fan
Mike's - Continuing rage!  Really good Mike's the whole way through.
TMWSIY-Avenu - I absolutely love this combo.  And this version does NOT dissapoint.  Way to keep up the energy of avenu going into...
Sloth - High energy
Sparkle - always a place in my heart for this song.  But I don't go after it.  This was a quality rendition
***I'm now realizing how great this show is.  It's well above average, although at this point I haven't noted anything unbelievably spectacular.  The quality of playing, the energy, the on-stage antics (secret language etc).
Mife - I love the acoustic intro and they did real well changing speeds during the verses.  Another high quality tune.  And I like the little ditty at the end.
McGrupp - Always, always good.  Just really good, even with the slight guitar flub at the end.
Purple Rain > HYHU - I liked Fishman with this one.  Better than other PRs that I've heard.  I like it.
Antelope - RAGING.  This was fantastic!  Really liked it.
Carolina - It was acapella.  This one was done well though.  Better than the norm.
LaGrange - Yet antother well played tune.  Awesome.

Overall, this show is above average.  I thought it had good flow and song selection.  It was really rockin'.  Definitely not in my top 10 or anything, but one of those shows that get filed under "Quality Performance".

Jephrey

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 17, 2006, 02:21:16 PM


Man, that is a GREAT Reba.  It isn't "over the top".  But, it sounds GORGEOUS.  The band hits the jam with everything they got.  Effortlessly and egolessly.   I will definitely keep this Reba around.  I like it.  I like it alot.  Reba just sounds so nice. 

the Reba and Mockingbird SMOKE!

Nice bro :-D

mikes>diddy was hot, and the alvenu>sloth is pretty epic, the mcgrupp was good, especially since it had a tight mfmf before it.  the mcgupp lacked intensity imo, not like the 12/30/93 version which was on fire...

so who goes next?

I've had a couple listens today, and while I could dig into every tune, I'm just gonna say, this show is a perfect example of why I wish I had seen these guys back in the good ol' days. Using only the history of the band up until this show, it's really a hot number. Well played, and probably a lotta fun to have been there. Love the Stash, one of my favorite Forbin>Mockinbird segments. Really not a fan of rollercosters, but i enjoyed this ride. Second set is solid, but in some ways is a let down following that first. Mike's is pretty good, bit sloppy, but i personally think Mike's is one of those songs that should be played as though they've never played it before. Avenu>Sloth is probably my favorite segment of the whole show, the segue Got Me.

Anyway, good show, I really am a fan of the earlier days, might even pick one from earlier in '93 or maybe an '89 when my pick comes around. But, that could change bye the time I do pick one.
I give this one a solid B+. The sound is good too.

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 12:12:44 PM
the mikes didnt do it for me either...

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 04:50:21 PM
mikes>diddy was hot

OK, now you're just confusing me!   :-D

    Nice, this will definately work out ...and they say phishheads are unorganized... :roll:
Roller coaster to Gamehendge now loading at Darien Lake. For your own safety keep arms inside the vehicle and tightly secure your face. Its going to be a wild ride.
   Just finished set I on my commute. Two big thumbs up from birdman. After the opening warmup trio this set really takes off. Love the stash, I felt the jam was a pretty unique, polyrythmic journey. Definately like the transition into Makisupa...you can hear plenty of great Stashes in 93 but Makisupa was a different beast back then.
  The Reba is a beaut, no wanking...got some goosebumps at the beginning of the Chill part...always a good sign.
Love the Forbins/Mockingbird...especially when treys screaming and yelling as they descend on the coaster...classic Phish.

   This is definately a good snapshot of the band on a hot night in 93. I love the work they put into the vocals, the harmonies are as good as they ever got. The playing is tight as a nut, which is what I got me into the band in the first place. And they only have one gear...overdrive.  Like Ikki said earlier, it really is a great snapshot of when the band was just beggining to hit their stride.
  Cant wait to hear set II...I have it on XLII down in the basement, might have to dust it off for old time sake.

   Brought out the XLII and threw it in the deck....listened for about two minutes before removing the cassette and throwing it in the trash.   It was like listening through a tin can. Thank God for digital. :-D

so aug... i'm gonna see if perhaps we can get a child board within the general topic just for this... that way each week can be its own thread, and it wont be too difficult to wade through all the info.

that would be tight!
a

got it!  if you didnt already notice!

so each week whoever is picking the show should start a new thread saying "week x: x-xx-xx said venue" and that way everything can stay organized better!

Nice job Jedi...iIt would have been a mass cluster otherwise.

mass cluster = cluster fuck :-D

aug- whats up with the 3 minute antelope?  and the 10 min HYHU?

Quote from: jedifunk on May 17, 2006, 09:41:07 PM
aug- whats up with the 3 minute antelope?  and the 10 min HYHU?

is that how it is?
a

you guys might want to change that.... :oops:
a

no biggie... its actually like this

purple rain > hyhu
antelope
crowd noise
encores

good thing all the track numbers are alright.
i just ripped it and didnt verify the info the came up.....

next time it wont happen to me.
i refuse to be the victim again.
a

ok here we go...

first and foremost i've gotta say that this source sounds incredible!  if everything sounded this good, i'd love every show from any era...

ok now for the show:
llama, bouncin, poor heart... i was still awestruck by the sound quality, but that just added to the show... all three are super tight and the interplay is great.

stash->makisupa: sweet!  i liked trey's playing as it was distinctly stash, but just enough off center to be interesting... nice buildup before the return to the main theme, and then a decent segue into makisupa... great version of maki as well.  i liked how they took it out to play a little...  probably the highlight of the show for me.

reba->maze: the composed section of reba was spot on, and i really enjoyed how well they were pronuciating the lyrics... guess i've never really tried to hear the lyrics before, but i enjoy it...  as for the jam?  ehh, i thought they were a bit to quick to move away from the beginning mellow part of the jam... it started to build to the climax too early.  but once it got cookin, it was on!  i dont think theres another song in their catalog that can soar as high!  maze, nice addition of the whistling in the intro.  not a big maze fan, doesnt really do much for me, and this was only a so-so version.

forbins->mockingbird, cavern: fun ending to a tight set... classic trey babble.

2nd set: gonna do it all as one because nothing really jumped out and grabbed me.  i did take notice during the "jam" segment of mcgrupps... otherwise, a fairly typical set.  it had great flow and moved along crisply, but again, nothing really grabbed me.

overall, a great show, and i would agree with the earlier assesments that it showcases them breaking out of being just another band, and becoming phish.

i'd give it a B+, if it ends up staying on my HD it probably wont get too much airplay... sound was great, and the playing was tight, but i guess i keep expecting more from these Aug 93s that everyone is soo high on.

Ok set II, did I mention this was one of my favorite shows of all time?  In light of that I'll give a full song by song break down, sorry if this gets really long! :wink:

2001 opener is standard, goes into. . .

Mike's, now I think it was Gumbo who pointed out that 2001>Mike's to open a second set is always a very good omen, and he's completely right, 8-2-93, 12-30-93, 6-22-94, and of course the daddy of them all 7-17-98 (as far as the actual 2001>Mike's goes)  these are all outstanding sets, and lo and behold this one is no exception.

So yeah, Mike's, if you haven't listened to this yet, or if you need to listen to it again (I listened to it twice today myself) turn the bass up!! When the Stranglehold section hits Gordo is dropping some serious bombs! They play through where Hydrogen or later Simple would normally come in and there is some intense grooving around the 5 or 6 minute mark with Page especially hitting the organ HARD right here.  Then Trey goes to bizarro disonant land, which I guess isn't for everybody, but I think the weirdness before the "Irish" diddy is great, if only for the fact that this is such a weird atypical jam to my ears.  The actual diddy is not bad, they are so synched up at the beginning I feel this must be a variation of something they practiced. Am I imagining a Hydrogen tease from Mike at the end of it, or is Trey playing All Things Reconsidered?  I hear something here.  But for me the real money shot is next, it starts when Trey finds that eerie high pitched line, then Fish comes in with the woodblocks, this is some great "spooky" Phish which leads right into Kung. . .


Which is great but then . .  .

Back into Mike's where they DESTROY EVERYTHING!   It doesn't get much hotter than this folks.

OK, let's take stock we just heard a Mike's>Kung>Mike's with language teases, and a one of a kind "Irish" jam in there too, without a doubt a top version of the song for me. 

The ending matches nicely with TMWSIY, which although it's always the same, I have to say that I think it stands as an example of some of Trey's best composition ever, it's absolutely gorgeous.  And how could you get sick of a song they so rarely played in the later days.  Perfectly placed in the set after the intense opening sequence, and of course into . . .

Avenu, what can I say, I'm a Jew.  :-D  I always love to hear this as it makes me think of going to temple, being with my family and a whole lot of other stuff.  Is that a L'Chaim! shout out by Trey before Mike's solo, I can't really tell what he's saying.  This goes into . . .

Sloth, which is a smooth segue as has been noted, but I actually think the Kung>Mike's is more dynamic.  Great tune, I think it should have stuck around in later years, what the hell does Trey say at the end anyway?

Sparkle is Sparkle, I'm not gonna complain about 3 and a half minutes in the middle of a set like this.

MFMF, man, this was the first song I ever saw Phish perform, so yeah it's a favorite, especially with the acoustic intro, and then we get kicked some weird bonus outro jam during which Page actually comes up with the most interesting melodic idea in the middle section, as noted Page is amazing throughout this entire show.  Which creates yet another tight little segue into. . .

McGrupp, I love this tune, it's a rarity that I actually got to see, and I think this version is notable.  Again some great playing by Page here and the jam at the end with Fish on the washboard  has a cool Latin feel to it, and am I nuts or are there I Can't Turn You Loose teases by both Mike and Page at the around 8:00 minute mark?  Check it out, I'm 99% sure of this one. 

Purple Rain is Purple Rain,

Antelope, I almost was gonna say this is typical 93 hotness, but toward the end they really get it cookin' and the pre-Rye Rye Rocco segment is a little more stretched out than normal, definitely an above average 'Lope.

Look, this set was genetically engineered in a lab to be my favorite set, the outstanding Mike's, Avenu, my first song MFMF, and rarities I saw in person like McGrupp and La Grange, it all just comes together for me, if I was stuck on a desert island with just this show, I'd be alright I think.  So yeah I give it an A+.

Sorry about the length, I'll probably have a whole lot less to say next week.   :mrgreen:   
 

You're right about the L'chaim
(side note - my sister's rabbi is a guitar player and an old deadhead. I was at a musical service last year and him and the mandolin player teased friend of the devil before a spiritual song. He's gotta hear this :-))
I need to listen again for the I can't turn you loose tease

Has anybody else heard the Stairway to Heaven line in the Maze guitar solo?

Quote from: jedifunk on May 17, 2006, 10:47:20 PM
reba->maze: the composed section of reba was spot on, and i really enjoyed how well they were pronuciating the lyrics... guess i've never really tried to hear the lyrics before, but i enjoy it...  as for the jam?  ehh, i thought they were a bit to quick to move away from the beginning mellow part of the jam... it started to build to the climax too early.  but once it got cookin, it was on!  i dont think theres another song in their catalog that can soar as high! 

I couldn't have said it better myself!   :wink:

Quote from: ikki on May 17, 2006, 05:07:53 PM

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 12:12:44 PM
the mikes didnt do it for me either...

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 04:50:21 PM
mikes>diddy was hot

OK, now you're just confusing me!   :-D

august made reference to how he didnt particularly like the mikes and i was agreeing.  i gave the show some re-listening and really liked the  segue from mikes>diddy.  thats what i meant, i should have been more clear and used some quotes,

the mikes didnt do it for me, the transition from mikes>diddy is hot. :wink:

Well, looks like I'll certainly be on a Summer '93 kick for a while.

Quote from: whatapiper on May 18, 2006, 11:14:36 AM

Quote from: ikki on May 17, 2006, 05:07:53 PM

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 12:12:44 PM
the mikes didnt do it for me either...

Quote from: whatapiper on May 17, 2006, 04:50:21 PM
mikes>diddy was hot

OK, now you're just confusing me!   :-D

I was just messin' with you anyway, but I'd consider the "Diddy" to be part of Mike's.  Personally if I was tracking the show I'd make Mike's>Diddy one track, because really this jam does come directly out of Mike's, and I even think I hear a Hydrogen tease during it, it only completely (to my ear at least) diverts from the Mike's theme right before Kung with that high pitch thing. 

august made reference to how he didnt particularly like the mikes and i was agreeing.  i gave the show some re-listening and really liked the  segue from mikes>diddy.  thats what i meant, i should have been more clear and used some quotes,

the mikes didnt do it for me, the transition from mikes>diddy is hot. :wink:

I was just messin' with you anyway.   :wink:

But I'd consider the "Diddy" to be part of Mike's.  Personally if I was tracking the show I'd make Mike's>Diddy one track, because really this jam does come directly out of Mike's, and I even think I hear a Hydrogen tease during it, it only completely (to my ear at least) diverts from the Mike's theme right before Kung with that high pitch thing. 

I didn't hear a Stairway tease in Maze slslbs, but I'll relisten tonight.

i too would call it mikes->kung->mikes, and track it as such...

after a relisten, i'm still not sold on the 2nd set.  the mikes really doesnt do anything, and its really not that much of a ripper either

I like this idea, here's my review:

Llama>this tune defined Phish for me in that era.  Tripped out solo buy Trey>mini-atonal section into stratsospheric ascension.  Recording has great sound, Mike clearly audible.  Textbook.

Stash>Trey begins in the middle register, slashing ascension>slight simple teases>back into atonal territory of swhirling tension>up an octave>nice groove underneath>jam peaking>Trey sawing his way through>release @ 10:40>Stash modulation w/ tension teases/releases.

Reba>active beginning>nice work by Trey>tight>soaring peaks>nice group sustain>great version, A+.

Mike's>cool little jan before Kung

Antelope>jam begins nicely>frantic ascension, impressive but gets better...

Overall decent show w/ set 1 outshining set 2.  The energy garnared in Stash was put to good use in Reba, the clear highlight.

the stirway tease is there, good call to whoever caught that. 

Set II
La Grange Yeah, in the days of yore Trey could explore dirty southern rock. I wonder how long his beard was when he played it.
Mike's did not do it for me either - liked the Ditty segue though.
Purple Rain - will Fishman reach the high note? Nope, but who cares. You can't go wrong with a Prince song (have you guys ever checked Patti Smith doing When Doves Cry? You should).
And once again props for Page. He is the star of the show.

All in all this is an B++/A- Great sound and the guys are clearly enjoying themselves.

Ok, on to the second set.  I think I have a differant opinion than a lot of people here...so I'm just going to unleash it.

This second set rocks!

2001-->Mike's Is The Perfect Way to open a set...especially a 1993 second set.  I know my opinion is going to be unpopular here...but I ABSOLUTELY ADORE the 2001's from 93/94.  They are absolutely the perfect length, with a condensced funk explosion.  I think the post '96 2001's were WAY TOO LONG.  Many people don't like the repetitive spaciness of the Sand jams, and I dislike the later 2001 jams for the same reason.  I'd rather hear a 20 minute tweezer anytime, than a 10 minute 2001 and a 10 minute tweezer.

And...this 2001 does not dissapoint!  It is HELLA FUNKY.  Good way to pump up the crowd to get the fuck down to the second set.

And the Mike's...the Mike's is fantastic!  I love the Mike's Song sound in 93.  It's so upbeat, so organic, so driving.  Is it a top ten Mike's??? No.  Is it a kick ass Mike's?  YES.  The first 6 minutes are so powerful that it makes the average later Mike's look like a leisurely stroll in the park.  The band is ripping it up there.  Fishmans drumming especially amazes me during this Mike's.  There's a small lull after the Mike's closing chords... and then Mike rages back off in tweezeresque spooky Mike's territory.  Nothing thematic.  Nothing ripping...just weird wanking around.  The part that's labelled "Irish Diddy"  is just more fun spacy wanking... it doesn't even sound "Irish" to me at all.  But it is cool as hell and  I happen to enjoy this.  Then there is the "fuck off" and "oom pa pa" signal....and the Kung.  This is fun!!!! How can you not like this?  Sure it doesn't have the rockin' Stranglehold teases from 8-13 (Oh my god did they tear that Mike's up)...or the Rockin' Thematic Beauty of the 12-30-93 (which has a lot in common setlist wise with this set...if you like this set...get 12-30-93 which is like this set on steroids).  People that don't enjoy this Mike's, I just don't understand it...it rips.  The Kung and signals are great...and the Mike's "reprise" rips too. 

The thing I fault the band for is not playing Weekapaug.  TMWSIY-->Weekapaug would have been PERFECT.  I'm surprised they never did a Mike's-->TMWSIY-->Weekapaug (no avenu...just the TMWSIY by itself)....it just seems like it would work so naturally, and I kept thinking during the TMWSIY that I wish they would have just gone into weekapaug...but it wasn't to be.

TMWSIY-->Avenu is cool, none the less...I always enjoyed seeing those live...and the > into the sloth is cool as hell too.  (Not really a segue, because Avenu stops and the sloth picks up after the rest...)  But this The Sloth is DONE RIIIIIIGHT.  Such a fun tune...and they rock it out well.

After The Sloth is Sparkle, and Sparkle is another one of those tunes that gets hated on that I LOVE!  Great lyrics....fun song...good dance number.

My Friend My Friend is up next...and it is a good version of the tune.  I like this one a lot too.  Man this set is going on long...no screaming at the end?!?

I happened to see a version of the song with the no screaming ending that segued into dog faced boy because trey jumped on the mini kit and started a weird space jam where the screaming ending was supposed to be (11-21-95).  Which was funny because I told my "krewe" on the way to the show "You know, as much as I love My Friend, you can't really do much with it, because you can't jam it or segue it..."  On the way home everyone was like "HAHA JOKES ON YOU...I THOUGHT THEY COULDN'T SEGUE IT!"

I love the disco wah licks trey unleashes during the My Friend...really cool My Friend.  And the segue is smooth.

McGrupp...good version...a little shaky in the solo part, however...but the solo does meander into...PURPLE RAIN!

This goes along with my when the fish song is "Bike", it's probably a killer show...similarly...when the fish song is "purple rain"...it's probably a killer show.

The Bomb Factory, 12-30-93, 2-20-93 what do all three of these CLASSIC shows have in common?  Besides being top 10 (arguably so) classic phish shows?

Purple Rain, that's what :)

This is probably my fave Fishman tune, and I like it....good job.

Antelope opens playfully.  I love playfull openings like this.  Page lets off some ULTRA LOW CHORDS from his piano.  And Mike and Trey's arhythmic rhythmic interplay is awesome.  The way Trey teases the "first gear" charge is fun.  This opening is ultra playful and cool.  Big thumbs up from me!  And then when the 2 minute interplay is over...they unleash the gun.   Trey front and center please.  This is anti machine gun machine trey.  So quick, effortlessly and circularly his fingers slide across the fretboard.  Nice:)  After this Trey starts playing a five note melody over and over again...which is pretty freaking cool. Duh duh duh doodly doo.  Duh duh duh doodly doo.  And then it starts to morph into something resembling this riff on lsd.  Oh yeah and then just when you think they've lost it...another gear shift torrent of flower power is unleashed.  I like this Antelope a lot.  Nothing that sets it appart from the average 'lope, except the fact that it smokes hard.  Page is banging away so hard near the end of the jam section that it's rediculous.  He sounds like Jack Kerouac banging away like mad at a type writer.  The sound on this bad boy is so noiicccce!  And Mike in the background is subtley going wild and trying to keep up with the madness.  Listen to Trey and Page bring it down!!!!

Reggae time.

Nice.  More playfulness from the band!  Page on the hammond chording it up.  Some YEAAHHH'S from fishman.  And you finally hear some crowd noise!!!! GREAT SET ENDER.

This is an awesome second set.  Not the best second set...or really a classic second set...but a great one.  I would have been quite happy to have seen this live.  Sure it's way similar to 12-30-93 and 12-30-93 destroys it version to version (damn what a show)...but the songs are rocking and fun...and that's how I like them.

Carolina...La Grange encore...nothing over the top...but still a fitting encore to a great show (except why they sing Carolina outside of Carolina is WAY BEYOND ME...just doesn't make any sense).

La Grange...good rockin encore song...I'd rather hear it than "Fire" (which is similar, but in my opinion is the WORST COVER PHISH HAS DONE (BESIDES OF COURSE CIRCUS, WHICH IS JUST A HORRIBLE SONG TO BEGIN WITH))  And it's a good La Grange taboot.

Good pick.  I'm sorry that the Mike's song moves me:)  And if you like this set at all and haven't heard 12-30-93 GET IT NOW (i'm sure I'm preaching to the choir here...but you never know). 

I'll probably keep the second set of this show on my hd for a while.  It's probably the Blandest 8-93 show I've heard so far...so that should tell you something about how good that month is :) :) :)  :mrgreen:

sorry faux, but the 2001 is NOT funky...  but i do agree with the timing.  i much prefer a 8-10 min version vs a 20 min one.

and the mikes may rip but not that hard.

vs some of the other aug 93s i've heard (not many) its at the bottom.  definitely enjoy 8/13 & 14 more.

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 06:14:45 PM
sorry faux, but the 2001 is NOT funky...  but i do agree with the timing.  i much prefer a 8-10 min version vs a 20 min one.

and the mikes may rip but not that hard.

vs some of the other aug 93s i've heard (not many) its at the bottom.  definitely enjoy 8/13 & 14 more.

The 2001 is the epitome of funkiness.

And the Mike's rips hard.  A lot harder than 11-22-97  :-D

BTW, did you read my last sentance...I said it was the blandest 8-93 I've heard...that's a testament to the magnificence of the month because it's still a great show.

Much like 12-17-95 is in my opinion the blandest december 95 show, but it's still A GREAT show.

8-7-93, got the right show?

It's a 2001-by-the-numbers and the Mike's is kinda flat, almost listless. I almost get the feeling that this was played to a less than half empty place (which I know isn't true) and they lost interest. The segue makes me think they got bored and decided to play something else instead.
The second set just doesn't have the same energy that the first does. (too much set break fun me thinks)

how do you get funk out of something thats not?  there is very little funk in this version... it merely a run though of the main theme, trey throws a little itty bitty bit of funk in but not enough to call it the epitome of funkiness.


and yes the mikes rips harder than 11-22-97, but that only because the hampton version doesnt rip, it funks...

jees, get it right already... your all mixed up, you think things are funky when they rock, and think they rock when their funky

Quote from: jonyem on May 18, 2006, 06:23:54 PM
8-7-93, got the right show?

It's a 2001-by-the-numbers and the Mike's is kinda flat, almost listless. I almost get the feeling that this was played to a less than half empty place (which I know isn't true) and they lost interest. The segue makes me think they got bored and decided to play something else instead.
The second set just doesn't have the same energy that the first does. (too much set break fun me thinks)

Yup.  You got it right.  I love 2001-by-the-numbers.  Like I explained the 93-94 2001's are my favorite ones.  And in my review I explained why I enjoyed the Mike's so much.

You'd be surprised to find out that my two favorite 2001's are 12/30/93 and 6/17/94 (whaddayasayoj?)

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 06:25:46 PM
how do you get funk out of something thats not?  there is very little funk in this version... it merely a run though of the main theme, trey throws a little itty bitty bit of funk in but not enough to call it the epitome of funkiness.


and yes the mikes rips harder than 11-22-97, but that only because the hampton version doesnt rip, it funks...

jees, get it right already... your all mixed up, you think things are funky when they rock, and think they rock when their funky

Huh?  A wah pedal the funk does not make.  I bet if you asked Trey, he would say that 2001 is funky so NAH!

Just because something is slowed down doesn't make it "funkier".  Ask James Brown.

And the 11-22-97 might "funk" and by that, I mean "STINK".

Quote from: ikki on May 18, 2006, 03:46:29 AM
Ok set II, did I mention this was one of my favorite shows of all time?  In light of that I'll give a full song by song break down, sorry if this gets really long! :wink:

2001 opener is standard, goes into. . .

Mike's, now I think it was Gumbo who pointed out that 2001>Mike's to open a second set is always a very good omen, and he's completely right, 8-2-93, 12-30-93, 6-22-94, and of course the daddy of them all 7-17-98 (as far as the actual 2001>Mike's goes)  these are all outstanding sets, and lo and behold this one is no exception.

So yeah, Mike's, if you haven't listened to this yet, or if you need to listen to it again (I listened to it twice today myself) turn the bass up!! When the Stranglehold section hits Gordo is dropping some serious bombs! They play through where Hydrogen or later Simple would normally come in and there is some intense grooving around the 5 or 6 minute mark with Page especially hitting the organ HARD right here.  Then Trey goes to bizarro disonant land, which I guess isn't for everybody, but I think the weirdness before the "Irish" diddy is great, if only for the fact that this is such a weird atypical jam to my ears.  The actual diddy is not bad, they are so synched up at the beginning I feel this must be a variation of something they practiced. Am I imagining a Hydrogen tease from Mike at the end of it, or is Trey playing All Things Reconsidered?  I hear something here.  But for me the real money shot is next, it starts when Trey finds that eerie high pitched line, then Fish comes in with the woodblocks, this is some great "spooky" Phish which leads right into Kung. . .


Which is great but then . .  .

Back into Mike's where they DESTROY EVERYTHING!   It doesn't get much hotter than this folks.

OK, let's take stock we just heard a Mike's>Kung>Mike's with language teases, and a one of a kind "Irish" jam in there too, without a doubt a top version of the song for me. 

The ending matches nicely with TMWSIY, which although it's always the same, I have to say that I think it stands as an example of some of Trey's best composition ever, it's absolutely gorgeous.  And how could you get sick of a song they so rarely played in the later days.  Perfectly placed in the set after the intense opening sequence, and of course into . . .

Yes, i did say that back in a thread a while ago.  I dont remember what we were talking about, but I do remember saying that.  However, I am super glad that somebody else finally "gets" the Kung>Mike's Reprise.  The Mike's jam proper before the whole Irish>Kung thing is nothing too amazing, except for Page's awesome Hammond work (Trey seems to not be too into it at the beginning), but man oh man oh man....  when Fish's drum fill comes up, they instantly turn that shit up to 11, and immediately begin hosing off the universe with this sickest of sick climaxes.  If only they could go from zero to Hose on cue like that later on.  This is definitely, without a doubt, one of my top 5 favorite Phish moments ever.  Its just amazing.

and im glad you took note of TMWSIY.  I think that this may be the most beautiful thing Trey ever wrote, right up there with Slave To The Traffic Light, Billy Breathes, and Reba Chill.

Quote from: Gumbo72203 on May 18, 2006, 06:36:58 PM

Quote from: ikki on May 18, 2006, 03:46:29 AM
Ok set II, did I mention this was one of my favorite shows of all time?  In light of that I'll give a full song by song break down, sorry if this gets really long! :wink:

2001 opener is standard, goes into. . .

Mike's, now I think it was Gumbo who pointed out that 2001>Mike's to open a second set is always a very good omen, and he's completely right, 8-2-93, 12-30-93, 6-22-94, and of course the daddy of them all 7-17-98 (as far as the actual 2001>Mike's goes)  these are all outstanding sets, and lo and behold this one is no exception.

So yeah, Mike's, if you haven't listened to this yet, or if you need to listen to it again (I listened to it twice today myself) turn the bass up!! When the Stranglehold section hits Gordo is dropping some serious bombs! They play through where Hydrogen or later Simple would normally come in and there is some intense grooving around the 5 or 6 minute mark with Page especially hitting the organ HARD right here.  Then Trey goes to bizarro disonant land, which I guess isn't for everybody, but I think the weirdness before the "Irish" diddy is great, if only for the fact that this is such a weird atypical jam to my ears.  The actual diddy is not bad, they are so synched up at the beginning I feel this must be a variation of something they practiced. Am I imagining a Hydrogen tease from Mike at the end of it, or is Trey playing All Things Reconsidered?  I hear something here.  But for me the real money shot is next, it starts when Trey finds that eerie high pitched line, then Fish comes in with the woodblocks, this is some great "spooky" Phish which leads right into Kung. . .


Which is great but then . .  .

Back into Mike's where they DESTROY EVERYTHING!   It doesn't get much hotter than this folks.

OK, let's take stock we just heard a Mike's>Kung>Mike's with language teases, and a one of a kind "Irish" jam in there too, without a doubt a top version of the song for me. 

The ending matches nicely with TMWSIY, which although it's always the same, I have to say that I think it stands as an example of some of Trey's best composition ever, it's absolutely gorgeous.  And how could you get sick of a song they so rarely played in the later days.  Perfectly placed in the set after the intense opening sequence, and of course into . . .

Yes, i did say that back in a thread a while ago.  I dont remember what we were talking about, but I do remember saying that.  However, I am super glad that somebody else finally "gets" the Kung>Mike's Reprise.  The Mike's jam proper before the whole Irish>Kung thing is nothing too amazing, except for Page's awesome Hammond work (Trey seems to not be too into it at the beginning), but man oh man oh man....  when Fish's drum fill comes up, they instantly turn that shit up to 11, and immediately begin hosing off the universe with this sickest of sick climaxes.  If only they could go from zero to Hose on cue like that later on.  This is definitely, without a doubt, one of my top 5 favorite Phish moments ever.  Its just amazing.

and im glad you took note of TMWSIY.  I think that this may be the most beautiful thing Trey ever wrote, right up there with Slave To The Traffic Light, Billy Breathes, and Reba Chill.

Have you heard 6-22-94?  If not you need to get it soon!

If you like the Kung-->Mike's from this show...I think you will LOVE THE Icculus-->Mike's from this show.

and this is where the battlelines are drawn...

those who prefer earlier phish will die for it... as will those who prefer later phish...

one mans funk is another mans rock...

either way this show is pretty good

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 06:48:39 PM
and this is where the battlelines are drawn...

those who prefer earlier phish will die for it... as will those who prefer later phish...

one mans funk is another mans rock...

either way this show is pretty good

Haha exactly.  What I like about it is what you don't like about it.  So you'll be like "what the hell do you mean you like that...it sucks" and I'll be like "I mean I like it...don't make me mention something you like that I don't" and then you'll be like "you are damn crazy".  And I'll be like "I know and I love it."

I almost think of the different eras of Phish as being different bands. The '93 Phish is a different band than the '97 Phish, etc. In discussing this show, and listening with a more critical ear, i tried my best to erase all i know of them since that show, to be as impartial as possible. So, with that in mind, up to that point there were better Mike's and 2001's, and that's the basis for my saying that one is flat and the other funk-less. I like the different versions of Phish, even if I prefer one over the other. It's really unfair to compare a '93 with a '97 cuz they're apples and oranges. Those shows were played by different bands.

agreed... i was never comparing this show to any other... i try to do the same when listening to a show.

in my defense, if you reread my review of the show, you'll see that i enjoyed it... they were very tight and on point, and took some risks... those risks probably seem more tame compared to later on, but at the time those were HUGE risks and they paid off in a great show.

and as we speak/type... i'm listening to the show again for the 4th time, so obviously i like it.

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 07:00:35 PM
agreed... i was never comparing this show to any other... i try to do the same when listening to a show.

in my defense, if you reread my review of the show, you'll see that i enjoyed it... they were very tight and on point, and took some risks... those risks probably seem more tame compared to later on, but at the time those were HUGE risks and they paid off in a great show.

and as we speak/type... i'm listening to the show again for the 4th time, so obviously i like it.

I think what I took "offense" (I mean I wasn't offended you know, just felt baited into a debate) to was the fact that I explained in lengthy detail why I had the opinion that I did and you reduced it to..."I don't like that, why do you?"  when I had taken a lot of time to explain it....

ya know?

  Just finished the second set in the car. Love the second set as much as the first, but differently. Many of you have praised the first set over the second and I agree that its more musically pleasing. The second set however, epitomizes summer 93 phish. At the time this 2nd set would have rocked my world. Most importantly because many of the songs are fairly rare and I would have checked off quite a few firsts from this one night alone (took me 3 years since my 1st show (10/31/92)to see a makisupa, kung,la grange.  Anyway I think the show, mainly set II, is important historically in that its like a 2/20/93 seguefest...not huge amounts of jamming but the playfullness and willingness to take some risks.
  Personally I loved the Kung>Mikes...absolutely loved it. Right on Gumbo. If you like thischeck out the Stash>kung>stash from 4/14/93. Its very similar in that they come crashing back into stash at mach 10 and then continue playing both songs at once.
   As far as 2001 is concerned. Its definately funky, but very similar to deodata version of the tune. They just began playing it that summer so it is only a baby version at this point. I saw one at Great Woods that summer and it blew my mind that they even played it at all.
Also, Jonyem, attendance=5,387 in a venue that seats 16,000.  Good ear!

Quote from: birdman on May 18, 2006, 07:20:37 PM

Also, Jonyem, attendance=5,387 in a venue that seats 16,000.  Good ear!

I'd like to thank the taper for that guess.
Wow, really?
Just goes to show how much I was actually paying attention to this recording.

I'm gonna have to give it another listen, I just didn't get that about the second set.
DO OVER!

I have only finished set one and set two up to the return to Mikes. I think the first set is strong, impressive stash, around 9-10 min range there is some stuff I enjoy, very cacophonous(?sp) but somehow it works. I love when Phish does that, Reba was good, but seemed like it built to fast, but for me the longer the build, the longer the tension. That's just how I like my Rebas :-D. Roller coaster whatnot is fun, hadn't heard that before. I forgot maze, great stuff here, page played very well in his section and trey stepped up for his as well, a strong version, imho. I'm gonna hop on my bike and go finish set two :mrgreen:

Quote from: birdman on May 18, 2006, 07:20:37 PM
  Just finished the second set in the car. Love the second set as much as the first, but differently. Many of you have praised the first set over the second and I agree that its more musically pleasing. The second set however, epitomizes summer 93 phish. At the time this 2nd set would have rocked my world. Most importantly because many of the songs are fairly rare and I would have checked off quite a few firsts from this one night alone (took me 3 years since my 1st show (10/31/92)to see a makisupa, kung,la grange.  Anyway I think the show, mainly set II, is important historically in that its like a 2/20/93 seguefest...not huge amounts of jamming but the playfullness and willingness to take some risks.
  Personally I loved the Kung>Mikes...absolutely loved it. Right on Gumbo. If you like thischeck out the Stash>kung>stash from 4/14/93. Its very similar in that they come crashing back into stash at mach 10 and then continue playing both songs at once.
   As far as 2001 is concerned. Its definately funky, but very similar to deodata version of the tune. They just began playing it that summer so it is only a baby version at this point. I saw one at Great Woods that summer and it blew my mind that they even played it at all.
Also, Jonyem, attendance=5,387 in a venue that seats 16,000.  Good ear!

Yes, but you have to remember, that this means that the Amphitheatre portion itself was actually full.  While I'm sure they didn't hang drapes to seperate the lawn from the pavilion, I'm sure it didn't seem "empty" inside the pavilion itself.

And yes, it is very similar to the Deodato version, and I like these embryonic 2001's a lot... I think they are actually FUNKIER than the more extended forays.  It seems like the longer they made 2001, the more watered down they became (in my opinion).

Quote from: disco on May 18, 2006, 07:26:43 PM
I have only finished set one and set two up to the return to Mikes. I think the first set is strong, impressive stash, around 9-10 min range there is some stuff I enjoy, very cacophonous(?sp) but somehow it works. I love when Phish does that, Reba was good, but seemed like it built to fast, but for me the longer the build, the longer the tension. That's just how I like my Rebas :-D. Roller coaster whatnot is fun, hadn't heard that before. I forgot maze, great stuff here, page played very well in his section and trey stepped up for his as well, a strong version, imho. I'm gonna hop on my bike and go finish set two :mrgreen:

That's exactly how I listened to the set last night!  The second set is good for the road :)

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 07:04:45 PM

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 07:00:35 PM
agreed... i was never comparing this show to any other... i try to do the same when listening to a show.

in my defense, if you reread my review of the show, you'll see that i enjoyed it... they were very tight and on point, and took some risks... those risks probably seem more tame compared to later on, but at the time those were HUGE risks and they paid off in a great show.

and as we speak/type... i'm listening to the show again for the 4th time, so obviously i like it.

I think what I took "offense" (I mean I wasn't offended you know, just felt baited into a debate) to was the fact that I explained in lengthy detail why I had the opinion that I did and you reduced it to..."I don't like that, why do you?"  when I had taken a lot of time to explain it....

ya know?

no, i dont know... i'm not sure where you thought i was saying "i dont like it, why do you?"....  i dont really see where i devalued your liking this version or your explanation...  so i'm a little confused ???

Quote from: Gumbo72203 on May 18, 2006, 06:36:58 PM

Quote from: ikki on May 18, 2006, 03:46:29 AM
Ok set II, did I mention this was one of my favorite shows of all time?  In light of that I'll give a full song by song break down, sorry if this gets really long! :wink:

2001 opener is standard, goes into. . .

Mike's, now I think it was Gumbo who pointed out that 2001>Mike's to open a second set is always a very good omen, and he's completely right, 8-2-93, 12-30-93, 6-22-94, and of course the daddy of them all 7-17-98 (as far as the actual 2001>Mike's goes)  these are all outstanding sets, and lo and behold this one is no exception.

So yeah, Mike's, if you haven't listened to this yet, or if you need to listen to it again (I listened to it twice today myself) turn the bass up!! When the Stranglehold section hits Gordo is dropping some serious bombs! They play through where Hydrogen or later Simple would normally come in and there is some intense grooving around the 5 or 6 minute mark with Page especially hitting the organ HARD right here.  Then Trey goes to bizarro disonant land, which I guess isn't for everybody, but I think the weirdness before the "Irish" diddy is great, if only for the fact that this is such a weird atypical jam to my ears.  The actual diddy is not bad, they are so synched up at the beginning I feel this must be a variation of something they practiced. Am I imagining a Hydrogen tease from Mike at the end of it, or is Trey playing All Things Reconsidered?  I hear something here.  But for me the real money shot is next, it starts when Trey finds that eerie high pitched line, then Fish comes in with the woodblocks, this is some great "spooky" Phish which leads right into Kung. . .


Which is great but then . .  .

Back into Mike's where they DESTROY EVERYTHING!   It doesn't get much hotter than this folks.

OK, let's take stock we just heard a Mike's>Kung>Mike's with language teases, and a one of a kind "Irish" jam in there too, without a doubt a top version of the song for me. 

The ending matches nicely with TMWSIY, which although it's always the same, I have to say that I think it stands as an example of some of Trey's best composition ever, it's absolutely gorgeous.  And how could you get sick of a song they so rarely played in the later days.  Perfectly placed in the set after the intense opening sequence, and of course into . . .

Yes, i did say that back in a thread a while ago.  I dont remember what we were talking about, but I do remember saying that.  However, I am super glad that somebody else finally "gets" the Kung>Mike's Reprise.  The Mike's jam proper before the whole Irish>Kung thing is nothing too amazing, except for Page's awesome Hammond work (Trey seems to not be too into it at the beginning), but man oh man oh man....  when Fish's drum fill comes up, they instantly turn that shit up to 11, and immediately begin hosing off the universe with this sickest of sick climaxes.  If only they could go from zero to Hose on cue like that later on.  This is definitely, without a doubt, one of my top 5 favorite Phish moments ever.  Its just amazing.

and im glad you took note of TMWSIY.  I think that this may be the most beautiful thing Trey ever wrote, right up there with Slave To The Traffic Light, Billy Breathes, and Reba Chill.

We're on the same page man!  :-D

I'm not too sure about the rest of these cats though.  :wink:

Worst of 8/93??  Wow, that's harsh guys, I say it's the best, but I do think 8/2 gives it a serious run for the money. 

Quote from: birdman on May 18, 2006, 07:20:37 PM
  The second set however, epitomizes summer 93 phish.

I totally agree, I prefer the 2nd Set myself because I think it's the more unique and filled with bizarre improv.  Risk taking and weirdness, that's what I call off the hook!

The fact that the first set is sooo strong though, is why I label this a top shelf show. 

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 06:14:45 PM
sorry faux, but the 2001 is NOT funky...  but i do agree with the timing.  i much prefer a 8-10 min version vs a 20 min one.

and the mikes may rip but not that hard.

vs some of the other aug 93s i've heard (not many) its at the bottom.  definitely enjoy 8/13 & 14 more.

Right here is where I felt like you devalued my opinion.  It didn't seem like you had much positive to say about my review, but maybe I'm just being "sensitive" :)

I had already seen what you had written about the show, and understood that you liked it in general...so I knew what your opinion of the show was...I just didn't think it was appropriate to take a long and well thought out (at least I thought it was, now I'm not so sure) post in the thread, only to cast a negative light on something it was obvious that I had enjoyed.

If you had disagreed with specific things, or had specific points to make (other than "that's not funky" and "it doesn't rock so hard"), I might have felt like you were discussing my opinion with me, but it seemed like you were "reducing" my opinion just to say where I was wrong, and I thought I had done a good job in this thread of MAKING SURE that I didn't do that when I saw someone that I disagreed with (such as the negative comments I saw about the Mike's Song... not that I think those people are wrong, I just disagree...but I know it's fruitless to say "I'm right, you're wrong"...instead I was letting my comments speak for themselves.

That's basically why I thought you were debasing my opinion.  I hope I made sense.

I hope you don't think I'm p.o.ed, because I'm not at all, and I hope you aren't... because I'm not trying to p. you o.

Quote from: ikki on May 18, 2006, 07:48:29 PM





We're on the same page man!  :-D

I'm not too sure about the rest of these cats though.  :wink:

Worst of 8/93??  Wow, that's harsh guys, I say it's the best, but I do think 8/2 gives it a serious run for the money. 

You are simply insane if you think this show is better than the Tinley Park or Murat show.

Hell the Cinci Zoo show the day before is better.

That's all there is to it, you are insane.

And being the worst on 8/93 is like being the slowest guy to do an Ironman Triatholon...you're still a damn Ironman Triathelete.  Nothing to sluff at all.

Or perhaps last place in the Jeopardy Tournament of Champions.

You get what I mean.

i thought i was debating, but i can see where you could think i was devaluing your opinion...

as it stands, i dont feel like the 2001 is that funky, or perhaps i'm comparing it to 1997 when i think 2001 hit its stride and was the ultimate in funk... after that it became too much.

as for the mikes... i agree that it rips, and you obviously feel it rips more than me, but there are plenty of other mikes that rip harder... and i guess thats where it gets cloudy... its hard to take each song on its own merits without comparing it to another version...

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 08:03:11 PM
i thought i was debating, but i can see where you could think i was devaluing your opinion...

as it stands, i dont feel like the 2001 is that funky, or perhaps i'm comparing it to 1997 when i think 2001 hit its stride and was the ultimate in funk... after that it became too much.

as for the mikes... i agree that it rips, and you obviously feel it rips more than me, but there are plenty of other mikes that rip harder... and i guess thats where it gets cloudy... its hard to take each song on its own merits without comparing it to another version...

I think I was just being over enthusiastic perhaps in my review, since I enjoy phish a lot, and I really enjoy listening to this show.  Like I said, it rips in a '93 way, and I really like the '93 Mike's.  But it is far from awesome for the standard that was set by other '93 Mike's.  But some of the jamming is really really cool.  And I was trying to get more of a feeling of what I was hearing... And I know you were trying to start some discussion perhaps...but simply saying "it isn't funky" and "it doesn't rip too hard" is way too vague to discuss... and I hope you can see how quickly it just devolvs into "yes it is funky", "yes it rips hard" when no actual debate is taking place... I would hope in the book club we would have more too say than "This good/This bad".

In other news,  I'm still in shock and awe that Ikki thinks this is the best show of August '93.  I've heard of strange opinions before...but that's still left me scratching my head (sorry Ikki, I like the show too...there are just so many August '93 shows that I love hard!)

Also, I can see why some people like the first set more...I'm just more of a 2001-->Mike's kinda guy...especially of the 93/94 variety.  Sure this one doesn't match up with 12/30/93, 6/17/94 or 6/22/94...but it's still pretty damn awesome...and I would NOT HAVE minded seeing it at the show :)

And the thing I didn't like about the Narration in the first set is that for me...the Col. Forbin story should be CENTRAL to the narration of the tune.  I thought the Roller Coaster story strayed too far from the actual Col. Forbin story.  (For the record my favorite Forbin's Narration is 10/31/96...then again I'm biased because I was there.)  I think if Trey had better incorporated the Roller Coaster into the Forbin story, I would have enjoyed it more....but I digress.  :)

i listened to the show, finally, after reading all these pages of contentious  :wink:  reviews.

as has been said, this is a different band than what they grew into by '97, and the '97 and beyond style phish is the one i love and obsess over. listening to this show is more like a fascinating look into the past, a way to see so clearly the beginnings of ideas that wouldn't fully blossom for years to come.

take stash. great energy, but to my ears, kind of boring. yet fascinating. listening to trey, especially, as he tries out these new ideas for how to prolong a jam, and doing it in that very specific, sort of atonal style (i don't have a better musical vocab to describe this, but you know what i mean), is so cool. it's a style that of course would find its peak in '95, where they took this exact type of jam, founded on the same theories of tension and release and how to maintain that tension pretty much indefinitely, and took it out to the stratosphere. but meanwhile, back at this show, it doesn't really excite me that much, at least in terms of listening just to be blown away. maybe i've been corrupted by hearing too many versions of stash from '95 and later that are so many light years beyond what they're doing here.

which is not to say this is at all bad! what they're doing in '93 is still far beyond what any other rocks bands would even ATTEMPT in terms of group improv. which is what's so amazing to me about phish. here they are doing something totally freaky and unique in terms of pushing themselves to improvise without noodling or sitting still in a rut, and yet it's only the very tip of the iceberg they'd go on to uncover in later years.

so for me this show is fun, high energy, cool to hear, but not something i'd listen to again. i thought the highlights were makisupa and reba.  

the second set is cool, but doesn't thrill me in any way in particular. 2001 is NOT funky. maybe we're functioning with different definitions, but nothing phish did back then is FUNK. fishman is a BADASS drummer even in '93, but he didn't learn how to swing until '96/'97. and by the way, the deodata version of 2001 is 9 minutes long and is, in fact, funky.

part of my problem may be that i don't have many other shows from this era for comparison, so all i have to go on is the phish from later years, which for me is of course going to outshine this. however, having just last week listened to 8.28.93, i've gotta say i enjoyed that one more.

so i'm WAY in the minority with my opinion on this show, but so it goes. all told, this is the band that has something for everyone. and i love this idea of a show a week. if not for this, i never would have heard this show, and despite all my carping, i'm very glad i heard it.

Cactus.  You NEED 8-13-93 it's on etree RIGHT NOW.

It should be REQUIRED LISTENING for ALL phish fans.

Top 25 show to me FOR SURE.

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 07:58:46 PM

Quote from: ikki on May 18, 2006, 07:48:29 PM





We're on the same page man!  :-D

I'm not too sure about the rest of these cats though.  :wink:

Worst of 8/93??  Wow, that's harsh guys, I say it's the best, but I do think 8/2 gives it a serious run for the money. 

You are simply insane if you think this show is better than the Tinley Park or Murat show.

Hell the Cinci Zoo show the day before is better.

That's all there is to it, you are insane.

And being the worst on 8/93 is like being the slowest guy to do an Ironman Triatholon...you're still a damn Ironman Triathelete.  Nothing to sluff at all.

Or perhaps last place in the Jeopardy Tournament of Champions.

You get what I mean.

Dude, 8/13 is no contest, what's it got besides the Bowie,  Gin and the Mike's>Lifeboy?  This show we're discussing is two hours of non stop excellent Phish, that's non-debatable.  It might not be "most excellent", but really besides Sparkle there's not a snoozer in the bunch.  Each and every song is an above average version, IMO.   

I guess I could understand 8/14, but I think this first set rules over Tinley's no contest, and that probably makes the difference.  Set II 8/14 is classic though, no doubt.

And yes, I am insane!

Edit: I'll qualify that each and every song statement, by changing it to "Starting with the Stash each and every. . ."

What does the 8-13-93 show have?  OMG.

How about Fluffhead?  Lengthwise-->Llama opener?  Buried Alive-->Rift?  Oh Kee Pa-->Suzy?

The "filler" on 8-13-93 smokes the "filler" on 8-7-93 hands down.

Carolina or Amazing Grace?
La Grange or Highway to Hell?

I'd pick Amazing Grace paired with Highway to Hell anytime.

Oh, not to mention the killah YAMAR!

It's really no contest at all....and I haven't even mentioned the INFAMOUS Red Rocks show yet.

Oh yeah, Ya Mar is good, the rest is standard to me.  Rift?? C'mon you can do better than that!  :evil:

cactus, i'm with you on this...  AND you've done a much better job of getting your/my/our point across... so thanks, karma!

8-13 mikes is better IMO than 8-7... throw in the bathtub->yamar, and i'm already liking 8-13 way more than 8-7

Set two: not too bad. Great segues, love the MFMF>Mcgrupp and Page goes crazy in Mcgrupp. The Mikes>>>>Sloth is not to shabby either. Excellent choice for the first pick, do we have to keep our picks until the week, or can we post the db link early?

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 08:32:55 PM
8-13 mikes is better IMO than 8-7... throw in the bathtub->yamar, and i'm already liking 8-13 way more than 8-7

Exactly.  Add in a Buried Alive opener (BY FAR my favorite opener).  And a Amazing Grace, Highway To Hell (if you don't see the humor in the juxtopisition of those two tunes, than I actually kind of feel sorry for you) encore...and you have a KEELER show.

The 8-13-93 Mike's makes the 8-7 sound like a couch potato.

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 08:40:45 PM

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 08:32:55 PM
8-13 mikes is better IMO than 8-7... throw in the bathtub->yamar, and i'm already liking 8-13 way more than 8-7

Exactly.  Add in a Buried Alive opener (BY FAR my favorite opener).  And a Amazing Grace, Highway To Hell (if you don't see the humor in the juxtopisition of those two tunes, than I actually kind of feel sorry for you) encore...and you have a KEELER show.

The 8-13-93 Mike's makes the 8-7 sound like a couch potato.

See, for me, it's not about which particular version was better, I'm talking about whole shows here.  If I'm going to sit down and listen to an entire show, I think 8/7 is  far more of a consistently fun listen. 

I would say that without a doubt the Gin smokes anything from 8-7, but the cumulative effect of every song from 8/7, and the dynamics between the songs makes the show superior overall.  The Gin is the best Jam from either show, but shows are more than just isolated jams.

For me it's all about flow and complimentation when listening to a show, and in IMO 8/7 is hard to beat as a top to bottom all around great show.

I really beg to disagree.  I understand your point, but I disagree.  For me 8-13 is a great top to bottom show...and while 8-7 is a great listen...it hardly has enough to keep me interested.  I already know that it will probably be a long while before I listen to that first set again.  It's a great set, don't get me wrong, but there's not much to it.  The Stash is cool, but I don't really feel the need to listen to it again...maybe it's the unfinished nature of it...but I actually prefer the 8-13 version.  There are so many great shows from august, that this one simply goes to the bottom of the pile for me...it's a cool show...but not my favorite.

I do know how it feels to have an unpopular opinion, however.   I think that 12-16-99 is the best december 99 show, and I found out QUICKLY that most people feel the opposite way.  What is it that I hear in that show that no one else does?  I probably will sadly NEVER KNOW.  Does that mean I'm wrong for enjoying it so much?  Hell no!  Enjoy away my friend, enjoy away!  Just realize we aren't being harsh to it...in actuality we are boosting up other shows....which is not a crime at all!

This is awesome...  Go Show Club!!!  I can't wait for next week's installment.

Jephrey

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 09:03:48 PM

I really beg to disagree.  I understand your point, but I disagree.  For me 8-13 is a great top to bottom show...and while 8-7 is a great listen...it hardly has enough to keep me interested.  I already know that it will probably be a long while before I listen to that first set again.  It's a great set, don't get me wrong, but there's not much to it.  The Stash is cool, but I don't really feel the need to listen to it again...maybe it's the unfinished nature of it...but I actually prefer the 8-13 version.  There are so many great shows from august, that this one simply goes to the bottom of the pile for me...it's a cool show...but not my favorite.

I do know how it feels to have an unpopular opinion, however.   I think that 12-16-99 is the best december 99 show, and I found out QUICKLY that most people feel the opposite way.  What is it that I hear in that show that no one else does?  I probably will sadly NEVER KNOW.  Does that mean I'm wrong for enjoying it so much?  Hell no!  Enjoy away my friend, enjoy away!  Just realize we aren't being harsh to it...in actuality we are boosting up other shows....which is not a crime at all!

It's cool, I was enjoying the lively debate myself!   :-)

it can be so hard sometimes to debate something thats so objective as opinion...  and its quite interesting that we're all listening to the same show, yet coming back with such a wide variety of opinions...

plus i sometimes think its hard to put into words/type what you "feel" about a song or show, and that makes it even more difficult to have these conversations...

but overall, i'd say that this idea is gonna be a sucess!

i know, for a fact, that my pick is gonna get at least two people banned from here.
a

Quote from: august on May 18, 2006, 09:55:07 PM
i know, for a fact, that my pick is gonna get at least two people banned from here.
a

HaHa.  Man.  I can't wait to see that pick!

wow, now i'm really intrigued... by any chance am i one of the two?  just want to be prepared

Quote from: jedifunk on May 18, 2006, 10:02:09 PM
wow, now i'm really intrigued... by any chance am i one of the two?  just want to be prepared

the last two posters are involved.
thats all i can say for now.................
a

figures :roll:

If he wanted to be a true bastard, he would put up 12/17/99  :evil:

or 12-16-99 (or was that 11-22-97)

 :lol: :lol: God its killing me to not have time to join in the fun.  Next week!!!!!!!

Quote from: antelope19 on May 18, 2006, 10:18:17 PM
:lol: :lol: God its killing me to not have time to join in the fun.  Next week!!!!!!!

the mp3 links are up on the top page>
grab them!

the next show doesnt go until monday.
a

Quote from: whatapiper on May 18, 2006, 02:41:30 PM
the stirway tease is there, good call to whoever caught that. 

thanks - thought I was hearing things.

This is WAY better than Oprah's book club. Can't wait till next week.

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 05:50:49 PM
This goes along with my when the fish song is "Bike", it's probably a killer show...similarly...when the fish song is "purple rain"...it's probably a killer show.

The Bomb Factory, 12-30-93, 2-20-93 what do all three of these CLASSIC shows have in common?  Besides being top 10 (arguably so) classic phish shows?

Purple Rain, that's what :)

They debuted Purple Rain on 2-20-93 :? Damn, I always thought it was 7-16-93 for some reason. :lol:


This shows been in my collection for sooo long that I feel my opinion would be somewhat biased. With that said, I agree 110% with birdman's opinion of this show! :-D

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 08:20:17 PM

Cactus.  You NEED 8-13-93 it's on etree RIGHT NOW.

It should be REQUIRED LISTENING for ALL phish fans.

Top 25 show to me FOR SURE.

Damn, I have to TOTALLY agree with you there!

listening to 8-13 right now!  i already know that the mikes is the HEAT, and the bathtub->yamar is top shelf.. but the opening to the show is great.  lengthwise->llama, makisupa>foam!  excellent!

Been listening to that one last night on the way home and this AM on the way in.
Fluffhead!

THREAD JACK SUCCESSFUL!!!!!

:evil:

well, im going to put myself in the line of fire and say that i was really dissapointed when i bought the Tinley Park Live Phish release.  That 2nd set is just wayyy too atonal for me, i really hate when Phish does that stuff that doesnt make any sense.  Only the Dead could come close to making that kind of thing enjoyable.  Now, i do like it when Trey mixes up some atonal, out-of-key stuff in Run Like an Antelope sometimes and in other songs, but this 2nd set is just way too much for me.  I really dont like it at all, in fact, its out of its case/folder sitting in with the pile of cds of shows that i burned that i dont like/listen to.  The first set is alright, Divided Sky, and Esther is always a goodie, but in general, i think its a weak show.

but the thing with August 93, and 93 in generally really, is the crazy song jumps and setlists.  To me it seems they were looking to the Dead as inspiration this time, because to me, this is the only time period where there was a distinct difference between first and second sets, in terms of the setlist and the way the show went.  93 is really the only time that 2nd sets were almost always one big long segue, the way the Dead did it, with the first set being the time for individual songs and a couple segues here and there to heat things up and get ready for the 2nd set.  anybody else agree?

Quote from: Gumbo72203 on May 19, 2006, 03:44:51 PM
To me it seems they were looking to the Dead as inspiration this time, because to me, this is the only time period where there was a distinct difference between first and second sets, in terms of the setlist and the way the show went. 

what about 94?
especially fall 94.
a

Quote from: Gumbo72203 on May 19, 2006, 03:44:51 PM
93 is really the only time that 2nd sets were almost always one big long segue, the way the Dead did it, with the first set being the time for individual songs and a couple segues here and there to heat things up and get ready for the 2nd set.  anybody else agree?

have you listened to any of fall 97?  over half the 2nd sets from that tour are 5-7 songs long and are all linked into one via -> or >, more so that anything from 93... alot of 93 segues are entirely unsmooth and intuitive, whereas a good chunk of later year segues are a little bit more random and flow with the music.  one of the reason i dont enjoy the older stuff as much is that a lot of the segues are really forced, and you can tell.

^
Definitely agree with aug and jedi. To me, 93 was about tight, well played high energy sets and doing fun stuff. I think sometimes they did it just because they could, and it would be a blast. The segue fests are fun, but often are a bit contrived.
They were more serious about the music later on, with mind blowing jams and segues that seemed more natural. IMO 97 is more like the Dead than 93.
I like listening to both, but as someone else said, they are almost (not quite) like different bands.

Quote from: jedifunk on May 19, 2006, 12:18:22 PM
listening to 8-13 right now!  i already know that the mikes is the HEAT, and the bathtub->yamar is top shelf.. but the opening to the show is great.  lengthwise->llama, makisupa>foam!  excellent!

well heck. if the funk loving jedi says 8.13.93 is that good, i suppose i'd better check it out.

See for me since 93 was when they first began playing real segues, it's interesting to hear them learn this technique on stage as they're performing, it's totally fresh and new, and by 97 it was almost expected of them and that totally changes the dynamic of it, for me.

Having said that, I love a 97 segue fest as much as the next guy, just not in the same way. 

ikki- i see  your point, and i'll have to try that point of view on my next listen of a 93 show... cuz instead of hearing it as being "forced" i could choose to hear it as "learning how"... and thats a great way to listen!

I would agree with your assesment of it sounding "unsmooth" Jedi, or I might be more charitable and call it "raw", but I personally really like that raw or unsmooth quality, it just sounds so "real" to me, if that makes any sense.

"real" works for me, as long as you dont say that its "more real" than the more "mature" "refined" segues in the later years... ;)

   Its all about viewing the show in its phishtorical context. Juxtaposing  it with everything that came after takes away from its importance.  But compare this show to what came before...the segues and raritites really make this show stand out from those in the past..thats what makes the show important.
   While everyones opinions are valid, we should try to remember and place ourselves in the era during which the shows are played when making our observations. Thats not to say we shouldnt compare and contrast new/old, but it makes it a more "interesting" listen when listened to with "time machine" ears...does that even make sense?

Quote from: thelot on May 19, 2006, 10:00:35 AM

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 18, 2006, 05:50:49 PM
This goes along with my when the fish song is "Bike", it's probably a killer show...similarly...when the fish song is "purple rain"...it's probably a killer show.

The Bomb Factory, 12-30-93, 2-20-93 what do all three of these CLASSIC shows have in common?  Besides being top 10 (arguably so) classic phish shows?

Purple Rain, that's what :)

They debuted Purple Rain on 2-20-93 :? Damn, I always thought it was 7-16-93 for some reason. :lol:


This shows been in my collection for sooo long that I feel my opinion would be somewhat biased. With that said, I agree 110% with birdman's opinion of this show! :-D

Lot knows :-D

another great way to listen/view a show is in the context of being there...

i know there were plenty of shows i attended where i had an amazing time, and left the venue beeming from what i consider "a sick show"... and some of those just dont hold up on tape for me... new orleans 99 is like that... great show while it was happening, pretty standard in retrospect.

alot has to do with what your in the mood for... i think in person, setlist has a lot more to do with my enjoyment of a show than on tape...  hearing something that i'm extremely pumped to hear at that moment, just doesnt carry any weight for me years later on tape... i look at the setlist and listen to the show and just cant recapture those feelings...

of course there are always exceptions (12/13/97).

Quote from: birdman on May 19, 2006, 08:42:53 PM
   Its all about viewing the show in its phishtorical context. Juxtaposing  it with everything that came after takes away from its importance.  But compare this show to what came before...the segues and raritites really make this show stand out from those in the past..thats what makes the show important.
    While everyones opinions are valid, we should try to remember and place ourselves in the era during which the shows are played when making our observations. Thats not to say we shouldnt compare and contrast new/old, but it makes it a more "interesting" listen when listened to with "time machine" ears...does that even make sense?

I'm totally with you, and in fact I would argue that juxtaposing a show like this with everything that came after it makes it even more important.  There would have been no Bomb Factory, 20-30 minute Mike's and Tweezers, etc. etc. without shows like these, and listening with that frame of references really makes me appreciate shows from 93.

Btw, check out albanks comments on the torrent, at least someone out there agrees with me!  :wink:

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=25232

Notice how he also names 8/2 as a runner up, how cool is that?

I think you guys hit the nail right on the head.

i havnt checked this thread in a couple days so im not sure if this has been said in relation to the latest argument.  like everyone has said, 93 was the heat in terms of starting to break the rules, rock, tight composed sections, etc.  i do enjoy the 12 song 2nd sets from time to time, with some nice segues(tmwsiy>sloth) but most of the time im left wanting more from a particular song.   where could it have gone?  regardless, there have been sacrifices along the way, i saw 31 shows in 97-98 and i remember wishing that the setlists had the selection of a show from 93-94.  those are the years that got me into phish, and yet its ironic that all i seem to listen to is 97-98 and (gasp) post hiatus.   early phish is what got me hooked, 97 and 98 is what kept me there for life.

cant wait for the next show!!! any hints on what were gonna be listening to?

Quote from: whatapiper on May 20, 2006, 05:19:30 AM
i havnt checked this thread in a couple days so im not sure if this has been said in relation to the latest argument.  like everyone has said, 93 was the heat in terms of starting to break the rules, rock, tight composed sections, etc.  i do enjoy the 12 song 2nd sets from time to time, with some nice segues(tmwsiy>sloth) but most of the time im left wanting more from a particular song.   where could it have gone?  regardless, there have been sacrifices along the way, i saw 31 shows in 97-98 and i remember wishing that the setlists had the selection of a show from 93-94.  those are the years that got me into phish, and yet its ironic that all i seem to listen to is 97-98 and (gasp) post hiatus.   early phish is what got me hooked, 97 and 98 is what kept me there for life.

cant wait for the next show!!! any hints on what were gonna be listening to?

Yeah...Phish :roll:
Its going to be a fall 94 or 95 :mrgreen:

Quote from: birdman on May 19, 2006, 08:42:53 PM
  Its all about viewing the show in its phishtorical context. Juxtaposing  it with everything that came after takes away from its importance.  But compare this show to what came before...the segues and raritites really make this show stand out from those in the past..thats what makes the show important.
   While everyones opinions are valid, we should try to remember and place ourselves in the era during which the shows are played when making our observations. Thats not to say we shouldnt compare and contrast new/old, but it makes it a more "interesting" listen when listened to with "time machine" ears...does that even make sense?

Couldn't have said it any better myself. Well put birdman! :-)

wow, good quote, agreed!  from now on the time phactory will ensue

so is the next up at midnight tonight, cant wait!!

Quote from: whatapiper on May 21, 2006, 06:53:47 PM
so is the next up at midnight tonight, cant wait!!

yep.
maybe not midnight  :-) but tomorrow.
the birdman is gonna get his pick.

this is definitely something i am going to look forward to each week!
i think the first week was  success.
a

Sent my pick to jedi..
  can you feel the electricity in the air???

Quote from: birdman on May 21, 2006, 06:56:27 PM
Sent my pick to jedi..
  can you feel the electricity in the air???

Oh hell yeah.  This is like the night before Phil Collins released "No Jacket Required".

Quote from: fauxpaxfauxreal on May 21, 2006, 08:00:54 PM

Quote from: birdman on May 21, 2006, 06:56:27 PM
Sent my pick to jedi..
  can you feel the electricity in the air???

Oh hell yeah.  This is like the night before Phil Collins released "No Jacket Required".

:lol:

"I can feel it calling in the air tonight!!"

Nice discussions.

I like the idea of phishtorical context.  In '93 Phish was a good band, their shit was tight however they were not yet champion improvisers.  '93 Phish is like '68 Dead.

should i lock the thread at the end of the week?  or just let it go?

Just let it go, if some folks join in on this after the first one is locked, they won't get to add their two cents worth. I'm sure these will peter out when there's nothing left to say.

I won't let it die, I'll just keep coming back here periodically to rant about how this is

THE BEST SHOW ARRRVAR!!     

And lamenting being the holder of an upopular opinion with stuff like: 
     
DOESN'T ANYBODY CARE??!!!!        :-D

Quote from: ikki on May 23, 2006, 07:55:32 PM
I won't let it die, I'll just keep coming back here periodically to rant about how this is

THE BEST SHOW ARRRVAR!!     

And lamenting being the holder of an upopular opinion with stuff like: 
     
DOESN'T ANYBODY CARE??!!!!        :-D

Seriously, the day before is better.

No you're wrong  :wink:, and I've listened to it recently.

great YEM though.

its ok Ikki, im with you man.  Ive been preaching this show ever since i first heard it like over a year ago.  I dont know, i always get this feeling that the Phish moments, be they songs, shows, setlists, segues, etc etc that i bug out about are very low in favor amongst the masses on this board, this show being an example of that. 

So Gumbo, when are we gonna hear your extended review of the show?