Occupy Wall Street

[PIE-GUY]

another from FB...

[phil]

I'm far from being wealthy, and I'm kind of tired of hearing about protesters, etc.

Enjoy this cartoon

[rowjimmy]

Occupy Seattle's ranks are a little this tonight after last night's arrests.

Still folks are there and seem to have a good message.

[Guyute]

My favorite quote today:
Occupy Wall Street looks more like the parking lot of a Grateful Dead show than a protest.

Opie?

yes sir

[rowjimmy]

My favorite quote today:
Occupy Wall Street looks more like the parking lot of a Grateful Dead show than a protest.

Opie?

yes sir

In Seattle, it looked like a park across the street from Phish lot somewhere near the end of a long fall tour...

[mattstick]

I'm far from being wealthy, and I'm kind of tired of hearing about protesters, etc.

Enjoy this cartoon

Really?  You're tired of hearing about people protesting the wealthy elite fucks who ruined the global economy and got away with it?

But you're not tired of living in the 99% of people who have a small sliver of the wealth while your government continues to eliminate the middle class?

Kind of hard to believe, frankly.

[mattstick]

http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=23ef2427-ecb3-46ca-b4d6-cbf8413cfe9d

One of the juicier nuggets in TIME's wide-ranging new poll is that voters are embracing the Occupy Wall Street movement as they sour on the Tea Party. Twice as many respondents (54%) have a favorable impression of the eclectic band massing in lower Manhattan's Zuccotti Park than of the conservative movement that has, after two years, become a staple of the American political scene.

A closer look at the poll's cross-tabs provides a fuller picture of the movement's diverse support. Occupy Wall Street enjoys majority backing among men (57%) and women (51%), young (60% of respondents 18 to 34) and old (51%). Self-identified Democrats, unsurprisingly, comprise the left-leaning movement's largest bloc, with 66% professing support. But more than half of independents (55%) harbor favorable views of the protesters, as do a third of Republicans.

[runawayjimbo]

I'm far from being wealthy, and I'm kind of tired of hearing about protesters, etc.

Enjoy this cartoon

Really?  You're tired of hearing about people protesting the wealthy elite fucks who ruined the global economy and got away with it?

But you're not tired of living in the 99% of people who have a small sliver of the wealth while your government continues to eliminate the middle class?

Kind of hard to believe, frankly.

I'm tired of hearing people pretend this is a protest. It's not a protest; a protest seeks to bring about change, after which the protesters could say "We won!" or "Shit, back to the drawing board." This is a circus taking advantage of the (very justifiable) levels of economic frustration and uncertainty.

I'm tired of hearing about the evils of capitalism and corporations as the protesters drink Starbucks, take dumps in McDonald's, carry around the Macbooks and update their Twitter pages while shooting video from their smartphones as they try to bait the police into billy clubbing them.

I'm tired of the entitlement mentality of people in this country (mostly but not exclusively younger generations) who say "You shouldn't be bailing the banks out, you should be bailing ME out!"

They are making a mockery out of what should be a very real movement to bring actual reform (not the pseudo-reform band-aids suggested in the Taibbi article, all of which would maintain the status quo) to an economic and political system that is completely out of control. They are only looking for someone else to blame: bankers, oil companies, Fox News.

It doesn't matter; it'll all be over in a couple of weeks as the temperatures change.

All of the above, IMO of course.

[McGrupp]

I'm far from being wealthy, and I'm kind of tired of hearing about protesters, etc.

Enjoy this cartoon

Really?  You're tired of hearing about people protesting the wealthy elite fucks who ruined the global economy and got away with it?

But you're not tired of living in the 99% of people who have a small sliver of the wealth while your government continues to eliminate the middle class?

Kind of hard to believe, frankly.

I'm tired of hearing people pretend this is a protest. It's not a protest; a protest seeks to bring about change, after which the protesters could say "We won!" or "Shit, back to the drawing board." This is a circus taking advantage of the (very justifiable) levels of economic frustration and uncertainty.

I'm tired of hearing about the evils of capitalism and corporations as the protesters drink Starbucks, take dumps in McDonald's, carry around the Macbooks and update their Twitter pages while shooting video from their smartphones as they try to bait the police into billy clubbing them.

I'm tired of the entitlement mentality of people in this country (mostly but not exclusively younger generations) who say "You shouldn't be bailing the banks out, you should be bailing ME out!"

They are making a mockery out of what should be a very real movement to bring actual reform (not the pseudo-reform band-aids suggested in the Taibbi article, all of which would maintain the status quo) to an economic and political system that is completely out of control. They are only looking for someone else to blame: bankers, oil companies, Fox News.

It doesn't matter; it'll all be over in a couple of weeks as the temperatures change.

All of the above, IMO of course.

Thank you for articulating my thoughts on the whole thing so well.

[PIE-GUY]

"Bring actual reform?" Honestly, the "bandaids" that Taibbi is calling for are needed. They need to prosecute criminals. They need to put money into the SEC and get it right. They need to break up the "too big to fail" companies. These are not small bandaid measures. These are real reform.

[mattstick]

The big corps can exist while wall street is reformed. 
It's possible to own a Macbook and be in the 99%.

You should be mad about how big business and the government have been in bed together for way too long.

When your children look back on this era do you want them to see a time of unobstructed corruption on Wall Street - or do you want them to look and see a protest movement which eventually, regardless of how long it takes - helped Main Street ideals defeat Wall Street corruption?

[sunrisevt]

I'm tired of hearing people pretend this is a protest. It's not a protest; a protest seeks to bring about change, after which the protesters could say "We won!" or "Shit, back to the drawing board." This is a circus taking advantage of the (very justifiable) levels of economic frustration and uncertainty.

I'm tired of hearing about the evils of capitalism and corporations as the protesters drink Starbucks, take dumps in McDonald's, carry around the Macbooks and update their Twitter pages while shooting video from their smartphones as they try to bait the police into billy clubbing them.

I'm tired of the entitlement mentality of people in this country (mostly but not exclusively younger generations) who say "You shouldn't be bailing the banks out, you should be bailing ME out!"

They are making a mockery out of what should be a very real movement to bring actual reform (not the pseudo-reform band-aids suggested in the Taibbi article, all of which would maintain the status quo) to an economic and political system that is completely out of control. They are only looking for someone else to blame: bankers, oil companies, Fox News.

It doesn't matter; it'll all be over in a couple of weeks as the temperatures change.

All of the above, IMO of course.

So let me see if I've got this straight, jimbo--a protester is supposed to abstain from using any commercial products or services, and be impervious to cold, in order to have any credibility with you?

[nab]

I'm still trying to clear some misunderstandings about the protests in my own head.  As far as I understand it, from what I've heard and read, the main points of the protest are as follows:


1.  99% of the people are being taken advantage of by the 1% of the people who control a commanding amount of the wealth in the world.
2.  This advantage is made possible by governments that enable wealthy to manipulate the system and fix the game in their favor.
3.  The protest is an effort to start meaningful dialog in both Washington and main street about the fairness of American policy vis-a-vis laissez-faire capitalism.



My concerns are as follows:


1.  A movement that seeks to target the 1% as a source of equalization and fairness is not on a sustainable trajectory.  As resources are re-allocated from the top to the bottom, the population at the top shrinks.  In order to maintain revenue, one has to pull harder and harder on a shrinking population.

2.  Inequality is built in throughout the entire spectrum of the current tax code.  I got back over 2x what I paid into federal income taxes last year.  It was nice to have the money, but to pretend it was something other than wealth redistribution, would be both naive and foolish.  The rich aren't the only ones benefiting from loopholes in the tax code which is manipulated on both the top and the bottom to keep political intrests alive for both parties. 

3.  While there wasn't any ethical or honest philosophical underpinning for fixing the game for the rich, there really isn't one for fixing it against them either.  Dialog on these matters usually revolves around plattitudes like "Fairness","Self Made Man", "Big Business", or "Investors in the Private Sector", while seldom is there an understanding as to how any of them applies to governmental policy.  Simply put, populist attacks against any one group are usually generalist, arbitrary, and driven by emotion.  One of the best examples of this is the Obama policy of only raising taxes on households that make over 250 k.  Its a nice round number, but what justifacation does anyone have to let the guy who makes $249,999.99 off the hook.  If you are going to build an ethical arguement about who pays extra and who doesn't, then you're going to have to have something other than wealth statistics on your side to prove that making more than 250k a year makes you a burden to society and hence a target for redistribution. 

[mattstick]

There isn't one reason everyone is protesting.

People are picking up on this idea that the populous doesn't need to be tread upon by the top 1%.
That there is a better way of proceeding. 
That reform to big business and government needs to happen or else we're all fucked.

[Hicks]

Perhaps Occupy Wall Street isn't a protest but is a process to figure out exactly what is wrong and what the solutions may be.

Personally I think it's great that at least people are trying to do something rather than sitting on their asses watching Two and a Half Men.