Gun Talk Re: have you heard about...?

[UncleEbinezer]

As long as we count third world countries, we're doing ok.

I think I just found myself a new personal mantra.   8-)

[VDB]

Gun violence in America is off the chart compared with every other country on the planet. The gun-homicide rate per capita in the U.S. is 30 times that of Britain and Australia, 10 times that of India and four times that of Switzerland. When confronted with such a large deviation, a scholar would ask, Does America have some potential cause for this that is also off the chart? I doubt that anyone seriously thinks we have 30 times as many crazy people as Britain or Australia. But we do have many, many more guns.

If Fareed is going to use facts and figures to bolster his argument, he should at least be truthful. The U.S. has the 12th-highest firearms-related death rate in the world. Still high, but not "off the chart compared with every other country on the planet." And those deaths aren't all murders (the topic of the column) -- it breaks down to about 40% homicides, 56% suicides and 4% accidents.

I know, I know, this isn't going to change anyone's mind -- but if we are going to talk statistics we might as well be accurate.

I don't know the real numbers but violence and death rate are not the same thing.

You also just quoted wikipedia, and if you look at where the stats comes from, it's four different sources, and years looked at anywhere from 1993 to 2009, depends which country you're looking at. But I agree, we're not that bad compared to those ahead of us, i.e. South Africa, Colombia, El Salvador, Jamaica, Honduras, Guatemala, Swaziland, Brazil, Estonia, Panama, and Mexico. As long as we count third world countries, we're doing ok.

Yes, these stats are kind of messy. Yes, the countries topping the list aren't exactly paradigms of utopian progress.

But Zakaria made a hyperbolic statement about the U.S. being the absolute worst, and then dove into specific figures to try and back that up. Except his hyperbolic statement was merely that.

That's all I was bothering to point out.

[phil]

Thinking about picking up one of these bad boys for home defense

[UncleEbinezer]

I've been searching from some protection, but then I found this shirt and realized that is all I need.

[gah]

I've been searching from some protection, but then I found this shirt and realized that is all I need.

That's what one of the psycho killers was wearing. I forget which one.

As for the nerf gun, I'd got for a little more protection. I got a sweet old school super soaker, still in the box, never used I could get you. Ammo's easy to find as long as you got a tap, toilet, or shower. pm me if interested. (sidenote, you can also fill it with wine, put down some plastic, and have a good role playing night with your significant other - good times)

[runawayjimbo]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/security-guard-shot-in-arm-in-downtown-dc/2012/08/15/6306fbea-e6f4-11e1-9739-eef99c5fb285_story.html

Security guard for Family Research Council shot in arm in Washington; suspect in custody

WASHINGTON — An armed man walked into the Washington headquarters of a conservative Christian lobbying group Wednesday morning and was confronted by a security guard, whom he shot in the arm before the guard and others wrestled him to the ground, authorities said.

The man was taken into custody by the FBI and was being interviewed. Authorities did not identify the man or disclose where he was being interviewed.

Police and FBI officials said it's too early to know the circumstances of the shooting, which occurred around 10:45 a.m. at the headquarters of the Family Research Council, or whether it was connected to the group's activities.

"We don't know enough yet about him ... or mentally what he's thinking," said James McJunkin, assistant director in charge of the FBI's Washington field office.

The Family Research Council confirmed in a statement that the security guard was employed by the group.

"Our first concern is with our colleague who was shot today," the group's president, Tony Perkins, said in a statement.

The Family Research Council advocates conservative positions on social issues and strongly opposes gay marriage and abortion.

Perkins was an outspoken defender of Chick-fil-A President Dan Cathy's public stand against same-sex marriage, which made the fast-food chain a flashpoint in the nation's culture wars. The Cathy family foundation has funded the Family Research Council.

"He's taking a bold stand," Perkins said after Cathy's comments were reported. "Chick-fil-A is a Bible-based, Christian-based business who treats their employees well. They have been attacked in the past about their stand. But they refuse to budge on this matter, and I commend them for what they are doing."

[Buffalo Budd]

I've been searching from some protection, but then I found this shirt and realized that is all I need.

That's what one of the psycho killers was wearing. I forget which one.

As for the nerf gun, I'd got for a little more protection. I got a sweet old school super soaker, still in the box, never used I could get you. Ammo's easy to find as long as you got a tap, toilet, or shower. pm me if interested. (sidenote, you can also fill it with wine, put down some plastic, and have a good role playing night with your significant other - good times)

Spoken from experience I'm sure.

[VDB]

Thinking about picking up one of these bad boys for home defense

Anyone who needs multiple high-capacity magazines for their Nerf gun clearly is up to no good.

[barnesy305]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/security-guard-shot-in-arm-in-downtown-dc/2012/08/15/6306fbea-e6f4-11e1-9739-eef99c5fb285_story.html

Security guard for Family Research Council shot in arm in Washington; suspect in custody

WASHINGTON — An armed man walked into the Washington headquarters of a conservative Christian lobbying group Wednesday morning and was confronted by a security guard, whom he shot in the arm before the guard and others wrestled him to the ground, authorities said.

The man was taken into custody by the FBI and was being interviewed. Authorities did not identify the man or disclose where he was being interviewed.

Police and FBI officials said it's too early to know the circumstances of the shooting, which occurred around 10:45 a.m. at the headquarters of the Family Research Council, or whether it was connected to the group's activities.

"We don't know enough yet about him ... or mentally what he's thinking," said James McJunkin, assistant director in charge of the FBI's Washington field office.

The Family Research Council confirmed in a statement that the security guard was employed by the group.

"Our first concern is with our colleague who was shot today," the group's president, Tony Perkins, said in a statement.

The Family Research Council advocates conservative positions on social issues and strongly opposes gay marriage and abortion.

Perkins was an outspoken defender of Chick-fil-A President Dan Cathy's public stand against same-sex marriage, which made the fast-food chain a flashpoint in the nation's culture wars. The Cathy family foundation has funded the Family Research Council.

"He's taking a bold stand," Perkins said after Cathy's comments were reported. "Chick-fil-A is a Bible-based, Christian-based business who treats their employees well. They have been attacked in the past about their stand. But they refuse to budge on this matter, and I commend them for what they are doing."

Here's some more info.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/16/us/dc-shooting-blame/index.html

Again, this just shows that people are losing their fucking minds.

[runawayjimbo]

Details still coming in

Several People Shot Near Empire State Building, NYPD Says

A gunman shot as many as eight people before being killed by New York City police near the Empire State Building in Manhattan, said Detective Martin Speechley.

Emergency personnel arrived soon after a call about the shooting came in about 9 a.m., prompting police to close Fifth Avenue near 34th Street and diverting morning traffic in busy Midtown, according to television reports on WABC 7.

Several victims were taken away on stretchers to Bellevue Hospital Center and St. Luke's Hospital, the television station reported, and ABC helicopter images showed a body under a sheet in front on the Empire State Building's entrance.

A New York Police Department spokesman confirmed the events in a telephone interview, and hung up before giving a name. The FBI is on scene, said Peter Donald, spokesman for the bureau's office.

The New York shootings follow a series of mass killings, including one on July 20 near Denver, when a masked gunman opened fire at a midnight showing of "The Dark Knight Rises" in a suburban Aurora theater, killing 12 and injuring 58. James Holmes, a former graduate student in neuroscience at the University of Colorado in Denver, faces multiple murder charges.

In Oak Creek, Wisconsin, a gunman killed six people at a Sikh temple Aug. 5 before being wounded by police and taking his own life.

[mbw]

this onion article was published yesterday....

http://www.theonion.com/articles/nation-celebrates-full-week-without-deadly-mass-sh,29293/

today's update is priceless

[qop24]

Gotta love how the cops did more damage here than the shooter...I thought that more guns at a firefight meant less damage and faster resolution?

[gah]

Gotta love how the cops did more damage here than the shooter...I thought that more guns at a firefight meant less damage and faster resolution?

No, no, you're thinking of civilians with guns. The more civilians with guns at a firefight the less damage and faster resolution.

[qop24]

Gotta love how the cops did more damage here than the shooter...I thought that more guns at a firefight meant less damage and faster resolution?

No, no, you're thinking of civilians with guns. The more civilians with guns at a firefight the less damage and faster resolution.

Good call. Bloomberg needs to get rid of the NYPD and hire Blackwater then. That'll teach people a thing or two about using guns in public areas (literally).

[sls.stormyrider]

wow

GOP calls for broader gun rights, unlimited clips

   
TAMPA, Fla. (AP) — Republicans have strengthened the pro-gun-rights portion of their party platform, including a new call for unlimited bullet capacities in guns, in a defiant response to criticism that followed recent mass shootings at a Colorado cinema and an Arizona congresswoman's gathering.

The 2012 platform, approved this week by GOP convention-goers who nominated Mitt Romney for president, also endorses ''stand your ground'' rights for gun owners. That legal concept, which says gun bearers don't have to retreat if they feel threatened in a public place, drew national attention after February's fatal shooting of an unarmed Florida teenager by a neighborhood watch volunteer.

Republicans traditionally embrace gun rights in their quadrennial party platforms. The one approved this week went farther than those of 2004 and 2008.

Gun control advocates see it as an audacious answer to calls for firearms restrictions after a gunman killed 12 people in Colorado last month, and another gunman killed six people in Tucson, Ariz., early last year. Gabrielle Giffords, then a Democratic congresswoman holding an outdoor meeting, was gravely wounded in the Tucson assault.

''Gun control only affects and penalizes law-abiding citizens,'' the 2008 Republican platform said. This year's platform adds: ''We oppose legislation that is intended to restrict our Second Amendment rights by limiting the capacity of clips or magazines.''

The shooters in Colorado and Arizona used large-capacity weapons capable of firing many rounds quickly.

The 2004 GOP platform said ''law-abiding citizens'' should have the right ''to own firearms in their homes for self-defense.'' This year's platform supports ''the fundamental right to self-defense wherever a law-abiding citizen has a legal right to be.''

It calls for federal laws ''that would expand the exercise of that right by allowing those with state-issued carry permits to carry firearms in any state that issues such permits to its own residents.''

Dan Gross, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, said that, by making these changes, Republican leaders have ''put themselves farther out of touch with their constituents.''

His group supports bans on large-capacity weapons, which it says are ''designed to shoot a lot of people quickly and efficiently.''

David Keene, president of the National Rifle Association, told the NRA News that the 2008 GOP platform ''was perhaps the most gun-friendly platform that any party had ever adopted,'' and ''this year's Republican platform is even stronger in terms of dedicating a major party to the protection of the Second Amendment.''

Presidential nominees, not to mention the general public, often ignore party platforms. Top Republicans in Tampa, however, implored the public to study the 50-page platform document.

''We invite Americans to consider this platform, a call for dramatic change in government,'' Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell said in his convention speech Tuesday.