bt ph1997-12-09.flacf

[jephrey]

I anally made the fades proper at the start and end of the sets and renamed the tracks for archiving and listening to as a show.

http://db.etree.org/shninfo_detail.php?shnid=18048

http://bt.etree.org/download.php/10451/ph1997-12-09.flacf.torrent

[yourmomadance]

hellzz yeeeeeeeee

[mattstick]

I realize that you archive stuff like this, but what if someone has a corrupt file and they need files from the original SHN fileset?

What improvements, do you feel, have been made to the original?

Do you realize that your filename scheme isn't in-line with the "official" etree.org filename structure?

Consider that people spent a lot of time creating these things, and it's ideal if everyone has the exact fileset, not a hijacked/altered bootleg version of the original.

[jephrey]

I figured it was only a matter of time before someone would notice that I had made "adjustments" to their filesets.  I always note it and always make the same adjustments to nearly every fileset I get my hands on.

5-sec fade in.  set 1/2 track 1 before any significant noodling or the start of the song or any intro or speaking.
5-sec fade out at the end of set 1 and end of show, after the song or any speaking, leaving a little cheering so it sounds fairly natural
-the only time these are quicker is to fit the whole set on a disc.  I still won't get close to cutting out any music/talking.
Tracking follows the HPB.  No intro tracks, no cheering tracks, I will insert interview tracks for FM radio sets.  I combine the tracks and fade as necessary.
I only fade out/in between set-2/enc if it comes that way or if it helps me fit it on a disc.  
I fix everything I can as far as mid-set fades.  I really hate that.  If it's during cheering it's easy, just crossfade.  If there's music involved, I gotta line em up.  Not bad but tedious.

I figure...  now that a show can fit on one dvd, I want a nice clean set

fade in > set 1 > fade out.  fade in > set 2 > encore > fade out
or
fade in > set 1 > fade out.  fade in > set 2 > fade out.  fade in > encore > fade out

all tracks are numbered using set and track # as discs, in my case, are nearing obsoletion.  I'm more concerned what set it is, not which disc.

Plus, I listen to every show I burn.  In it's entirety, to validate its quality.

I've brought this up before over at those "other" forums.  Probably here too.  Maybe some will find sense in what I do and it'll help them out.  Maybe some will even incorporate an idea and make it easier for me.  Every now and then, I find a fileset that I don't even have to touch except for the track names.  That's sweet.

Ah well,

-Jephrey

[guyforget]

I think its fine to do that for your archives.  I dont know if Id seed it, but I dont have to download it if I dont want to.  

All that Id ask is that everything be properly noted in the txt files so that if you do seed anything people arent confused what happened to the files.  It may be obvious to you whats been done since its your standard practice, but everyone else is seeing the same source and taper/xfer info but an entirely different text file and no files that match the db.etree.org entry.  That alone would be enough for me not to download the fileset.  Id have no way of knowing if you ripped it from disc before you made these flacs and just used the same source info, or if you added fades and whatever else.  Any time I fix or change or rename or whatever a fileset before archiving I always make notes in the text files.

[jephrey]

That's what I was nervous about.  In this case it was easy.  I didn't show the lineage of going shn > aiff (modifications) > flac because I assumed it was obvious in not an issue if I hadn't ripped a disc.  But the text file does vaguely note modifications to the tracks aside from naming.  I'll also note more prominently, in the future, that the shnid is just the original fileset and that it has been modified since and I'll be more exact on the mods that were performed, including the renaming of files.  Just want to make sure I am doing this in a way that doesn't step on anyone's toes and continues the distribution of a high quality fileset.

-Jephrey

[guyforget]

in the future, that the shnid is just the original fileset and that it has been modified since and I'll be more exact on the mods that were performed, including the renaming of files.
-Jephrey

Bingo.  Heres an example of what I do when I fix something like this.  I recently downloaded this: http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=8917
but realized that it could be fit on 2 discs if I cut a few minutes of crowd noise (no music at all) from the encore and set break.  I wanted to archive it to dvdr, but I didnt want to pull it out in a year when I need to burn another copy and have to make the edits again.  Heres my text file:

Phish

July 21, 1999

Starlake Ampitheater

Burgettstown, Pennsylvania



Schoeps cmc64->Apogee AD-1000 @48kHz; DA-P1-> Audio Magic Presto II-> ZA2-> Soundforge 4.5 (48->44.1)-> CDWav-> .shn > wav (fixes) > FLAC

Transfer & Original Compression to shn by Eric McRoberts

Re-Tracking / Re-Mastering done by Allen Davis 11/20/04



Disc 1:

Set One:

1. AC/DC Bag >

2. Cities

3. Gold Soundz*

4. Ginseng Sullivan

5. Limb By Limb

6. Funky Bitch

7. The Moma Dance

8. When The Circus Comes

9. Taste

10. Bittersweet Motel



Disc 2:

Set Two:

1. Mike's Song >

2. Simple >

3. My Left Toe >

4. Prince Caspian >

5. Weekapaug Groove

6. Golgi Apparatus

7. Brian and Robert

8. Bold as Love

 

*Pavement cover; first time played.



Re-Tracking / Re-Mastering Notes:

This fileset exactly matched the archived md5 at http://db.etree.org/shn/1196

It was edited to keep the sets continuous on two 80 minute discs

Crowd noise was removed from the beginning of Mike's Song (00:12)

Crowd noise was removed from the end of Golgi Apparatus (2:12)

Crowd noise was removed from the end of Bold As Love (1:07)

Subsequently, Bittersweet Motel was moved to d1, and Brian and Robert and Bold as Love were moved to d2.  Also, a sector boundary error in Bittersweet Motel was removed with shntool by padding the end of the track.

All files were then converted to FLAC  



-AD_

[jedifunk]

Personally, I would prefer that shows with fades where NOT distributed.  It is not an exact replica of the original DAT source, and to be blunt, not at all helpful.

If I want fades I'll add them myself.  I'd be pretty pissed if there was a show I was looking for and it was available but had fades and other shit done to it.

Fine if you want fades, but keep that to yourself.  When I DL something I want an exact copy of the original DAT source, not somebody's hack job.

No offense to you, but post production work of this kind should be left up to the individual user, not the seeder of a fileset.  I don't want to be hamstrung by your naming/fading conventions.

So again, nothing against you, because we need as many people willing to seed shows as possible, but if your going to seed something, seed the original source.

Just my .02

[yourmomadance]

i agree with guyforget -- if you don't want to download this seed, you don't have to.

i do though, so thanks.

[jedifunk]

i think it goes beyond whether i download it or not.

like i said before, if i have to choose between dling or not dling a show i need/want because someone added their own interpretation to a fileset, thats bs.  seed the original source and keep your edits to yourself.  everyone's interpretation of a fileset and naming convention, etc is gonna be different, so i say let the end user decide what to do.

[yourmomadance]

i guess you have a point jedi.  you are right on the whole, but personally, i dont worry too much about the formatting/fading of all the shows i listen to.  but i totally understand how some people do.  i guess i'm just more of a "liberal" listener if you will.  so i'd still like to thank jephrey for the seed since i will download it and rock out to the fall 97 headdyness.  but i guess for the future, i will keep in mind the formatting standards.  thanks for the rock

[jedifunk]

oh yeah, don't get me wrong.  i'm glad jephrey is seeding shows, and helping out the community.  we need more seeders.

my personal preference is of absolute audio snobbery. :wink:

other than fixing tracks, i would prefer to get an original source and do the edits myself.  again, just my personal pref.

[jephrey]

My .02

Often, The original poster applies fades themselves.  An original DAT is still an original even if  lets say 10 secs of cheering was removed from the beginning.  You could say they started taping 10 seconds later.  In addition, with a fade, you're not possibly blasting your ears out.  You could say that the taper slowly turned up the levels on their dat.  The only thing that would upset me is if music was comprimised by applying these things.  Like I said, I never make mods between tracks unless I am re-joining two that someone faded and my product will never be of less quality than the original.

I also realize there's a matter of trust.  How do you know that the person applying the fades didn't cut out anything like the crowd singing happy birthday or some guitar noodling that gets you going when you pop the disc in?  All I can do is assure that I will not compromise this stuff to save space.

I get your point about this however.  I can imagine that you want to have something (in a database) to connect a  fileset that you have to.  I am pretty anal about things too but it boils down to the music.  I often don't like how I get filesets but as long as all the music is there, I can live with it.

The track names have been bugging me to hell.  I can't stand why we, as a community, would limit ourselves to disc and track number.  That's not kosher to the original DAT is it?  you would expect a tape# and the set uncut right?  I don't want someone else telling me how to track my aud discs anyway.  Really, I could care less how I get track names.  Like you said, people usually rename for use in stuff like iTunes and possibly audio discs.  I say post-em how you want and I'll change-em to what I want.

I definitely have respect for your and everybody elses views too.  I'll be getting into more ISOs, I'll have a list on etree soon and I will note in large print exactly the changes I make to any fileset.  If someone still wants it, I'll post it for them.  If not, I'm sorry I couldn't help.

No disrespect,

Jephrey

[mattstick]

What if everyone did exactly what you do?  There would be hundreds of copies of the same fileset in circulation, and none of them would be "certified" in db.etree.org.

I would'nt share my AAC archives, and you should'nt share your FLAC archives.

Now yourmomadance seems to be desperate to get these filesets, to the point where he'll take incomplete and re-FLACs of the originals, but we all know that it's best to circulate the exact SHNs/FLACs that are listed in db.etree.org, unless some improvements were required and have been made.

I think if you're going to use the bt.etree.org you should comply with the etree seeding standards;
http://wiki.etree.org/index.php?page=SeedingGuidelines

Maybe you should take a quick read thru...

[yourmomadance]

"it boils down to the music."

exactly